Teleporter device - big logical error?

[Morkonan]

......then why ...

There is nothing in Science-Fiction that you can't explain away or bring into being by using suitably scientificky-sounding reasoning... As long as it involves "technology" or "scientific knowledge" (the last is debatable, but only just so) then anything can have a legitimate Science-Fiction reason for existing... or not.

[Tenlar Scarflame]

Re: the device's apparent rarity... maybe it can only teleport the player because it requires a physical item - some kind of beacon, or a special suit component or something - to lock on to, and the player possesses the only one ever manufactured. As for why only one was ever manufactured, could be like Captain America's shield. Maybe we have the only teleporter in the universe because we have all of the known teleportium in the universe.

As for the old transporter devices from X2-X3...

Spoiler

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They're supposed to be a miniaturized relative of the jumpdrive/jumpgate technology, right? The Ancients' firebreak prevents jumpdrives from connecting to any gates... maybe it also prevents the oldschool transporter devices from working as well. Meaning whatever the new teleporter is, it's advanced enough to bypass the firebreak. Would make sense for it to be a lofty research goal.

[Kernel Panic]

Maybe it can only teleport the player because it requires a physical item - some kind of beacon, or a special suit component or something - to lock on to, and the player possesses the only one ever manufactured.

As for why only one was ever manufactured, could be like Captain America's shield. Maybe we have the only teleporter in the universe because we have all of the known teleportium in the universe.

Ah, yes. Unobtainium. There is a cliche...tired and truly overdone. The biggest problem with Unobtainium is that somehow the hero always seems to obtain it. Oh, that and the fact that all elements are created inside of stars at some point in the solar life cycle and this game is about flying a ship between stars so surely someone would find it just lying around from time to time. Even if it needs to be refined it would still occur naturally, if rarely. As an example consider these two things: Plutonium and Gasoline. Both occur naturally even though we refine them because we need more than nature gives us.

It would be better if the PHQ quest involved an auction among the races to use the teleporter technology and pay the player royalties. They could even have an option to put the technology into the public domain so everyone could use it and thereby avoid an all out war. Then you could have an entire campaign instead of locking so many great stories and plots behind in an vault that cannot be opened because there is no key.

I do not and will never think that any technology can exist in a vacuum. If it works at all for one person it must be reproducible by everyone. Even if the research was done by just one person and never published sooner or later someone else will stumble across the same ideas and the same research that inspired the original work. Did you know that the wheel has been invented at least 4 separate times in human history by different populations that had no way of sharing knowledge with each other? That is how science works. Anything else is fraud, amateur hour, or both.

[Chris0132]

I mean X already has unobtanium with AGI derived tech, Khaak tech, etc. With the destruction of the gate network it's not unreasonable that some knowledge might be lost, including long range point to point teleportation which was never mastered by the main races before the collapse.

I would assume therefore that the discovery is perhaps linked to finding some rare research base and the technology cannot be reproduced on the timescale we would operate on ingame. Or may indeed be dependent on things we can't source any more, such as Khaak tech.

Yes it might theoretically be reproducible, but that doesn't mean that you, the player, right now, can start mass producing it because you got the one you found working again. Or even that you would necessarily want other people to have that power.

[Vandragorax]

I really hope Egosoft implement the teleporter without ANY in-game explanation whatsoever. It's just "there" and we can use it

All of these wild stories, speculation, and 'scientific' reasoning are so amusing to read! Let's leave all the players to make up their own stories for the teleporter once they play the game haha

[atavistuk]

Considering two things, I think changes everything OP.

1: We get the LR Transporter Device Tech from the Player HQ station, which is a unique station in the universe. What if we can't reverse engineer it to figure out how to make more of them?

2: We can't Transport to NPC ships, so presumably we wouldn't be able to transport wares to them either. And maybe it has a cost to it, per transport, per distance, making it economically nonviable to transport anything en mass, or it has a cool-down, making it faster to transport wares over long distance. Or all of the above.

Honestly we don't know enough about it to start making random judgements about the logic of it. It works in the context of the game lore, being just a longer ranged version of some tech we already have.

[PabloRSA]

Well i'm sure there will be a Dead is dead game and the teleporter will be disabled.
Problem solved for the moaners.

[StoneLegionYT]

Well i'm sure there will be a Dead is dead game and the teleporter will be disabled.
Problem solved for the moaners.

Even if they added a dedicated option they would still moan others will use said feature. This the type of people you have now in a single player game...

[sd_jasper]

Considering two things, I think changes everything OP.

1: We get the LR Transporter Device Tech from the Player HQ station, which is a unique station in the universe. What if we can't reverse engineer it to figure out how to make more of them?

2: We can't Transport to NPC ships, so presumably we wouldn't be able to transport wares to them either. And maybe it has a cost to it, per transport, per distance, making it economically nonviable to transport anything en mass, or it has a cool-down, making it faster to transport wares over long distance. Or all of the above.

I'm not sure this is right. For 1, I think that it was mentioned in the early trailer that the Transporter device was discovered from some lost Terran Tech. I'd have to go back and watch again, but that is what I recall. It might not be useful till it is researched which is done in the PHQ if I understand the latest trailer. Or they may have chanced the device's origin as the game developed.

As for 2, I think at one point you could teleport to NPCs stations, but they were not sure if that was going to remain. That was still something they were looking into. So, I would assume that it at least has the possibility to work.

In all honesty, the new gameplay trailer, with talk of suit upgrades, makes me think that the teleport device is part of your suit, and probably one of a kind.

Honestly we don't know enough about it to start making random judgements about the logic of it. It works in the context of the game lore, being just a longer ranged version of some tech we already have.

I agree 100%. We don't know, and there could be a million different reasons why these devices were never mass produced, why you can't start producing them, why they don't work for cargo, etc., etc. But we can be here till release debating if those are "good" reasons or not.

[gbjbaanb]

Considering we had the transporter, I guess it'll just be researched to be better with longer range. Though I'm not too sure of whether a "research base" fits in with X games, compared to (say) a X4 strategy sim (a mission objective to collect the tech, like the Hub, would be a better way of obtaining the upgrades teleporter)

But I just dislike the idea of teleporting as a replacement for the jump drive. I like the option of jumping around in my favourite ship like I did in X3. If some sectors are huge (god help us) and there's no JD, it has the possibility to be a tedious game, either fast but dull travel in core sectors, or long and slow travel in exciting border sectors. Neither is optimal I feel and the JD helped mitigate both.

Egosoft has a track record in design mistakes here - Rebirth with highways and no SETA, that was later added back in because removing it was daft. I wonder if JDs will come back in later, but if so, I wish they'd have been thought through enough to be in from the start, making the gameplay more like X3 (because that worked!)

[spacecoyote99]

I wish they'd have been thought through enough to be in from the start, making the gameplay more like X3 (because that worked!)

I know this discussion has been had before, but for my two cents, JD in X3 always felt like "cheating". Being able to jump away from danger at a few seconds notice meant you never had to risk anything. Every sector in the universe was effectively one jump away, so even though there were many sectors, distance had no meaning.

I don't know yet whether teleportation is going to be an effective replacement (along with the other new travel methods) but I'm ready to give it a try.

[ZombiePotatoSalad]

Gameplay and Story Segregation. It's a method of allowing you to get around quickly. Imagine you want to get to one of your ships near a battle. You'd have to personally fly there, and during all this time, the ship you're going to may get blown up. The ship you are going to also may not even have a dock for your fighter, meaning you'll have to ditch in order to move to the other ship. Entering a ship is also not as fast as in X3, you have to do a bit of walking. It takes more time.

Just be glad there is one, I certainly am. It's a time saver, but not an overpowered one.

[atavistuk]

People are just scared to actually LOSE stuff, that's all this is.

"Oh no, I can't jump out my Capital Ships if I get in trouble now!"

"Oh no, my Universal Traders can't jump away from danger anymore!"

These are the only arguments AGAINST the Transporter Device that I've heard. The answer is, Git Gud, Scrub. Make sure your traders are trading in safe space. Get used to losing ships. Pick your fights carefully. Only fly what you can afford to lose. If you want to claim space, make sure you have the means to defend it first.

[DaMuncha]

What if I dont want a teleporter in my ship? What if I dont want it from the start? What if I think it looks ugly? Will I have to put up with them in EVERY ship? What if I have no intention of researching that? or no intention of building the player HQ?

One other thing was that my player ship had ALOT of software and extras installed in it that was un-needed by NPCs, like who would give a cargo ship Fight Mk3 software. My player ship had alot of exphensive crap on board that would cost a fortune to install on every ship I owned.

[Alan Phipps]

@ DaMuncha: Based on the information given so far:

1. Then don't have one.
2, You don't get it from the start anyway.
3. Then don't have one.
4. Not if you don't have the capability yourself.
5. Then don't research it.
6. Then don't build it.

All are your individual choices and you can live with the in-game consequences of those choices. It's a win - win situation, yes?.

OK, that was a bit tongue-in-cheek but I really don't understand what point you are trying to make. If you choose not to use something made available then that doesn't 'entitle' you to access to a bespoke alternative that achieves the same or similar results, in my view of course.

[sd_jasper]

What if I dont want a teleporter in my ship? What if I dont want it from the start? What if I think it looks ugly? Will I have to put up with them in EVERY ship? What if I have no intention of researching that? or no intention of building the player HQ?

Again, I think every ship has a TRANSPORTER, the TELEPORTER is probably just the technology that lets your transporter work over longer ranges (possibly tied to your suit). And as far as not wanting a transporter in your ship? Well they come standard. Every ship has them, NPC and player alike, and they are required to get from the docking bays to the bridge of large ships.

[DaMuncha]

Every ship has them, NPC and player alike, and they are required to get from the docking bays to the bridge of large ships.

Well we dont realy know that for certain yet.

[spankahontis]

@spankahontis: Good point - while I think that in the long term this would make freighters obsole, the mining ships would still remain cost effective:
- mine ore
- ferry it to factory
- process
- ferry product to nearest Trading Station with industrial teleporter.
- teleport it to other Trading station with industrial teleporter.


Kinda like HoL Warehouse, but with teleportation.

Just doesn't have to get to that point yet, maybe in a thousand years time the teleporter gets so advanced that it can teleport anything without the need of a Pad.

Still think that creating a temporary Synthetic Copy to teleport your Consciousness into would be a better idea.
On one hand you can visit far off places, on the other Hand, your Synth Copy has a Deadmans Switch of 3 hours and it's back in your original body.. Be like operating a Drone, so the modding capabilities for such a device shouldn't be that far off?

The Technology is there, they could of used Xenon/AGI nano-cells that can create complex structures, like People. They are programmed to disassemble after 3 hours because of science reasons.. Synthetic People with Human Consciousness are unstable and the Synth breaks down after 6 hours; there could be info into this, the risk to the persons consciousness in storage if the Synth short circuits.

[Drakuel]

The reason is simple, they wanted to give people a mechanic to find action or the ability to be apart of the action, when operating a entire fleet.. This isn't real world, it's a game where a single person is controlling multiple roles in simulated space enviroment.

Thank God it's not real world or this would be a boring position indeed, handing out commands behind a desk, reading reports as they come in, then adjusting commands, while other real people mined, traded and fought for you.

Could they just given every ship a robot, that you are able to VR control as the background for the mechanic instead of the word teleport, yeah but for me doesn't matter, I can pretend that's what it is.

[jamesdehunter]

The reason is simple, they wanted to give people a mechanic to find action or the ability to be apart of the action, when operating a entire fleet.. This isn't real world, it's a game where a single person is controlling multiple roles in simulated space enviroment.

Thank God it's not real world or this would be a boring position indeed, handing out commands behind a desk, reading reports as they come in, then adjusting commands, while other real people mined, traded and fought for you.

Could they just given every ship a robot, that you are able to VR control as the background for the mechanic instead of the word teleport, yeah but for me doesn't matter, I can pretend that's what it is.

Amen to this!

I can just imagine if Elite were to implement such a tool as the Teleporter it would be bogged down and hampered by efforts to make it fit within realistic science.

Fun gameplay > Realism, I learned that the hard way from my time in Elite Dangerous.