Next steps in the evolution of X4: Foundations

[shealladh]

I see that you don't give a chance that ES is implementing fuel and probably you're right. I'd be fine with imaginary fuel only as a cost though or a speed nerf much more preferable. Maybe, maybe.

At this point in time, yes.

The game has lots of opportunities to reach its potential but if only ES seizes them.

Personally I miss jump drives and the use of energy cells. Not a lot of people do think the same, yet having energy cells or combined with other components just adds more to the economy and fleshes out the flow of wares, imho is a good thing.

Well when we get some good thoughts out, and expand upon them giving them a reason to look at such a change/addition and why

I see mods as a last resort and I don't want to rely on them unless Egosoft doesn't deliver needed fixes/complete features. It's also an early-ish phase for giving up on that. Like you I'm waiting 2.0 to hit either to give up my hopes or embrace the vanilla till I get bored.

Most MODs are for thing to be a temp fix, so I agree there.

Exactly, it's good and I like the direction it's heading, however there seems to be something (a lot) of the old games missing.
I need a challenge, don't want to have to include/use the AI Wars MOD just to make things harder. Most people think when I say that, I want more grind, and to a degree yes, but it's more about the risk factor vs. reward than anything.

We need the pirate risk, the xenon threat, and some new elements of risk to make you think before you leap. It breaks without the player in a region, and breaks you sense of realism. For example, going through a sector that is radioactive, why is it there, why can't we mine it. It's seems to be just another cow prop sadly.

Then we need feedback form the universe as it unfolds, a spark of some life to put icing on the cake so not only can we immerse into it all, but can also feel apart of it and give the players a reason to keep coming back for more.

Not a fan of EvE due to it's extreme grind factor (and other things like auto mining/shooting etc.), but its a great sandbox to delve into. People hold back, probably the same as myself, making the leap into it all for many reasons. On the other hand there are some that can find enough to give it a go. That's what X4 is missing, that temptation of what you can do and achieve, that's the goal imho

I'm after that essence and feeling of what I've loved about the X-verse, and finally see ES change it so that you are "your character" on a journey rather than the character name they give everyone depending on your choice at the start. Hell, if we wanted that we'd be wanting to be Luke Skywalker, Alex Rogan, Spock, Malcolm Reynolds, Kara Thrace, or another Ellen Ripley. They need to break that away so that we can all be who we are and choose our name so that we can create OUR story within the confines of their verse.

[gschultz]

Hasn't been fixed yet.

Ouch. Generally speaking I'm a supporter of egosoft, but I'm kinda getting the impression here that they're either cherry picking like crazy or just out of touch with what people's complaints actually are.

Agreed.
That Said, I do however understand that the sheer amount of things that need to reworked, fixed, etc. goes on a list and ES has responded as to why certain things are a priority over others. Like if it's game breaking (CTD, etc.) it's high priority and then they work down through others. There are quite a few threads where they address these matters.

Even saying in one, that not all bugs being fixed are on the roadmap, but they fix them on the fly for minor ones and so on. So given time, like for me 2.0 is the waiting state for me to continue, they'll get these issues addressed.

People just need to list them, rather than just whining, the more factual information you can give, the easier it is for them to address when they can get to those.

they are gaming the community, and this chips away at a decades long relationship ive had with them. if they want us to see information they should release it in comprehensive posts, but in reality if they do address something it is hidden on a thread in one of many forums.

[Falcrack]

they are gaming the community, and this chips away at a decades long relationship ive had with them. if they want us to see information they should release it in comprehensive posts, but in reality if they do address something it is hidden on a thread in one of many forums.

They may not make promises, because they don't know if they will be able to deliver a fix within a given time frame, but I am pretty sure they are all coming to work each day, they are taking notes on what changes, fixes or features people want, making decisions as to whether they feel they are good ideas, and are not sitting on their bums all day long. Hostility in the forums only tends to drive them away, rather than make them want to engage the community.

[Blitz4]

They may not make promises, because they don't know if they will be able to deliver a fix within a given time frame, but I am pretty sure they are all coming to work each day, they are taking notes on what changes, fixes or features people want, making decisions as to whether they feel they are good ideas, and are not sitting on their bums all day long. Hostility in the forums only tends to drive them away, rather than make them want to engage the community.

Hello, nice to meet you Falcrack. I'm new to this thread and have to say, this is the best roadmap for X4 that I've ever seen.

I would like to engage in intelligent non-offensive constructive discourse, not just with you, but with all, which will reflect the views of all parties and on-lookers for eternity.. I can imagine, that type of discourse, is more difficult than making a game in Proton. Especailly when considering the learning curve of overcoming a new cultural barrier.

I understand X4 is their baby. But a baby can not grow without proper critism or correction. You speak of them them taking notes on what changes the community is complaining about. How do you know this for fact? The majority of complaints that I've come across on Steam aren't concerning a lack of features or new ideas, it's in regards towards existing functionality which is malfunctioning.

[El Novato]

They may not make promises, because they don't know if they will be able to deliver a fix within a given time frame, but I am pretty sure they are all coming to work each day, they are taking notes on what changes, fixes or features people want, making decisions as to whether they feel they are good ideas, and are not sitting on their bums all day long. Hostility in the forums only tends to drive them away, rather than make them want to engage the community.

Hello, nice to meet you Falcrack. I'm new to this thread and have to say, this is the best roadmap for X4 that I've ever seen.

I would like to engage in intelligent non-offensive constructive discourse, not just with you, but with all, which will reflect the views of all parties and on-lookers for eternity.. I can imagine, that type of discourse, is more difficult than making a game in Proton. Especailly when considering the learning curve of overcoming a new cultural barrier.

I understand X4 is their baby. But a baby can not grow without proper critism or correction. You speak of them them taking notes on what changes the community is complaining about. How do you know this for fact? The majority of complaints that I've come across on Steam aren't concerning a lack of features or new ideas, it's in regards towards existing functionality which is malfunctioning.

About your concerns on the dedication of egosoft in relation to taking notes on what changes the community is complaining about, you can do a survey across this forum and see that moderators and developers are answering to them. They hired or are hiring a person expert on MD, they had or have another two jobs posted, one for design, another for coding if i remember well, they are giving explanation in a constructive way to many of the doubts and about the lack of features, that´s is always something subjective. "Never is going to rain to the taste of everyone", in a direct translation from a spanish saying.

In my opinion they are involved to some degree with what the community say about the game. The final result will not be satisfactory for all, but i speculate it´s gonna be for most.

[rjlange]

they are gaming the community, and this chips away at a decades long relationship ive had with them. if they want us to see information they should release it in comprehensive posts, but in reality if they do address something it is hidden on a thread in one of many forums.

They may not make promises, because they don't know if they will be able to deliver a fix within a given time frame, but I am pretty sure they are all coming to work each day, they are taking notes on what changes, fixes or features people want, making decisions as to whether they feel they are good ideas, and are not sitting on their bums all day long. Hostility in the forums only tends to drive them away, rather than make them want to engage the community.

Why weren't they doing this with playtesters BEFORE release? If they had there would be much less hostility and I wouldn't feel ripped off. Don't let your worship of Egosoft cloud your fiduciary judgement.

[Falcrack]

they are gaming the community, and this chips away at a decades long relationship ive had with them. if they want us to see information they should release it in comprehensive posts, but in reality if they do address something it is hidden on a thread in one of many forums.

They may not make promises, because they don't know if they will be able to deliver a fix within a given time frame, but I am pretty sure they are all coming to work each day, they are taking notes on what changes, fixes or features people want, making decisions as to whether they feel they are good ideas, and are not sitting on their bums all day long. Hostility in the forums only tends to drive them away, rather than make them want to engage the community.

Why weren't they doing this with playtesters BEFORE release? If they had there would be much less hostility and I wouldn't feel ripped off. Don't let your worship of Egosoft cloud your fiduciary judgement.

Oh, I felt they definitely should have opened it up to a wider playtester base prior to release.

[davesom555]

One for thing for me is the end game, I can look past any bugs (I've not had any issues really since day one; except a 99k warp), bit when you get a billion credits there's not much to do with it! There kind of needs to be an evolving political system (ie empires team up against you to keep you from getting too powerful) or some way to of that much money. Plus need more exploration possibilities.

[wurst01]

{unnecessary massive quote removed - CBJ}

only one question, shall come terrain Fraktion back??

[CBJ]

We are not yet ready to discuss the possible return of any additional factions other than the Split.

[mr.WHO]

It's more or less open secret that Borons are in the work. Considering how many people whine about lack of Borons they are guarantee for DLC 2.
Personally I'd prefere Terrans, but well as long and they will be in DLC 3 (which is not confirmed/hinted by any source) I can live with it.

Somehow the dark part of me hope that Borrons will be more difficult to implement which will delay them and give DLC2 to Terrans.

[Sam L.R. Griffiths]

It's more or less open secret that Borons are in the work. Considering how many people whine about lack of Borons they are guarantee for DLC 2.
Personally I'd prefere Terrans, but well as long and they will be in DLC 3 (which is not confirmed/hinted by any source) I can live with it.

Somehow the dark part of me hope that Borrons will be more difficult to implement which will delay them and give DLC2 to Terrans.

Do the PHQ plot and we already see at least one Boron. Complete the data vault scans, and at least one of the entries seems to show Borons in an encounter suit of some sort.

I know Egosoft are neither going to confirm nor deny the return of the Boron as a faction but the biggest issue is likely to be addressing their ship and bridge designs in a way that seems to make sense. Given X2 and X3 Boron ships were pilotable by any race I would probably bet on Borons being implemented with encounter suits of some sort - assuming that they are that is.

[Admiral A-F]

I am a "old" user of the series all the way back to x beyond the frontier. These request is not linked together .

1. I would like a game start with 100 Credits missions that do not give more than 3.000 credits for a mission.
When you get Rank 10 with on race then the missions should change from 3.000 to 50.000 credits
with rank 20 from 50.000 to 500.000 and last rank 30 Station building and full quests.
It would also be nice to have different quest on each rank level.

2. achievement for not using SETA until 1 billion Credits and another if you use make an action each hour until 1 billion credits (so you do not let the PC play the game til you get the credits, so you do not have to do anything).

3. The game is to easy right now for earning credits, I would like it as the old days where you really had to fight for it.

4. More longer missions for special things, like in X3 to get the shipyard quest with reverse engineering you needed to get so much stuff and many quest for the station. I NEED THAT BACK! Please. Something to work for and hunt for. Not this easy stuff.

This is my short list I have a youtube Let's play where I go thought all the game from start to end. ( not finnish of cause but over 120 uploads with 1-2 hours each so far ) It can bew borring to wach but it is the hole game not only small things.

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=P ... Q8hzY_W1Ls

[adeine]

3. The game is to easy right now for earning credits, I would like it as the old days where you really had to fight for it.

This is definitely an issue right now, since you can just skip most of the different fighters as player ships and jump straight to M sized ones (which are basically just better all around), exacerbating what feels like lacking selection on the ship front. Price differences between different ship classes should be higher, allowing a more gradual transition beyond the early game.

If you had to work your way up to the better ships, you'd have time to appreciate the various tiers of S ships that are there.

[BrasatoAlBarolo]

3. The game is to easy right now for earning credits, I would like it as the old days where you really had to fight for it.

This is definitely an issue right now, since you can just skip most of the different fighters as player ships and jump straight to M sized ones (which are basically just better all around), exacerbating what feels like lacking selection on the ship front. Price differences between different ship classes should be higher, allowing a more gradual transition beyond the early game.

If you had to work your way up to the better ships, you'd have time to appreciate the various tiers of S ships that are there.

I definitely agree on this point: base ship prices should go up for medium class and over.

[shealladh]

I am a "old" user of the series all the way back to x beyond the frontier. These request is not linked together .

1. I would like a game start with 100 Credits missions that do not give more than 3.000 credits for a mission.
When you get Rank 10 with on race then the missions should change from 3.000 to 50.000 credits
with rank 20 from 50.000 to 500.000 and last rank 30 Station building and full quests.
It would also be nice to have different quest on each rank level.

I am also a Veteran ( ) as well

Starting out with a challenge sounds like my sort of deal.
Give me the worst, just flyable, type of ship you can.
Modify the missions available to reflect the rank with each sector based upon Faction Ranking. idea

2. achievement for not using SETA until 1 billion Credits and another if you use make an action each hour until 1 billion credits (so you do not let the PC play the game til you get the credits, so you do not have to do anything).

Maybe make one of the components you need to be a quest in which you need to search for the lost lock box that's it in. Only one left

3. The game is to easy right now for earning credits, I would like it as the old days where you really had to fight for it.

Instead of just credits, you should be able to have something else given along side lowering the amount of cheds.
Pity you cannot find Weapons and Ship Components like games of old. Loved being ale to collect them for "when" I got enough for a ship that could use them.
Have added an idea of a garage to be added, so you can bring back this sort of thing, and you can tune you ship and swap out parts.

Would also like to see weapon, shield, etc. wear and tare added to be required to spend those creds on something rather than having some megabillion number account

4. More longer missions for special things, like in X3 to get the shipyard quest with reverse engineering you needed to get so much stuff and many quest for the station. I NEED THAT BACK! Please. Something to work for and hunt for. Not this easy stuff.

Some special unlock items, special ship paint job for helping out the SCA, HOP, etc. Maybe a Special OPs paint job for completing a Argon mission with recon for Xenon, and so on.

Quests should, well most of the time, reflect your actions in a sector, vs. a faction, to be more noticeable, alongside being long or multiple part missions need to be expanded upon. Hopefully they hire that "Mission" person soon to do just that.

This is my short list I have a youtube Let's play where I go thought all the game from start to end. ( not finnish of cause but over 120 uploads with 1-2 hours each so far ) It can bew borring to wach but it is the hole game not only small things.

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=P ... Q8hzY_W1Ls

Someone needs to do a boring video of a tour around each sector as if you're an overworked, bored tour bus driver. "Now on your right is just another rock, to your right, ouch that civilian should have just smoked his own produce, damn look at that, we're at the local Equipment Dock, who needs a loo stop?"

Boring can be good

[Blitz4]

They may not make promises, because they don't know if they will be able to deliver a fix within a given time frame, but I am pretty sure they are all coming to work each day, they are taking notes on what changes, fixes or features people want, making decisions as to whether they feel they are good ideas, and are not sitting on their bums all day long. Hostility in the forums only tends to drive them away, rather than make them want to engage the community.

Hello, nice to meet you Falcrack. I'm new to this thread and have to say, this is the best roadmap for X4 that I've ever seen.

I would like to engage in intelligent non-offensive constructive discourse, not just with you, but with all, which will reflect the views of all parties and on-lookers for eternity.. I can imagine, that type of discourse, is more difficult than making a game in Proton. Especailly when considering the learning curve of overcoming a new cultural barrier.

I understand X4 is their baby. But a baby can not grow without proper critism or correction. You speak of them them taking notes on what changes the community is complaining about. How do you know this for fact? The majority of complaints that I've come across on Steam aren't concerning a lack of features or new ideas, it's in regards towards existing functionality which is malfunctioning.

About your concerns on the dedication of egosoft in relation to taking notes on what changes the community is complaining about, you can do a survey across this forum and see that moderators and developers are answering to them. They hired or are hiring a person expert on MD, they had or have another two jobs posted, one for design, another for coding if i remember well, they are giving explanation in a constructive way to many of the doubts and about the lack of features, that´s is always something subjective. "Never is going to rain to the taste of everyone", in a direct translation from a spanish saying.

In my opinion they are involved to some degree with what the community say about the game. The final result will not be satisfactory for all, but i speculate it´s gonna be for most.

Could you point me to where developers have stated there are issues with the AI, why collision damage has been disabled, when it will be re-enabled, when AI commands will be fixed, when AI will use travel drive, when fleets will stay in formation, where they are planning on fixing pathfinding or any mention of fixing anything related to what we consider 'broken AI'. I would also be interested in what version these broken features are planned on being fixed, please point me towards any public statements from the devs regarding that as well.

The AI is my main concern. The way I play X4 will change when AI commands are fixed (ie: assigning your ships to auto-Explore). But I'm also interested in 3 other things to be fixed: Economy, Warfare and Turrets. Please point me in the direction of the devs admitting that any of these 4 broken aspects of the game are 'broken', 'will be fixed' and 'when they will be fixed'. If you would, it'd make me sooo much happier.

I don't know what MD stands for. tbh, their new hires don't concern me, unless the existing devs or Egosoft has publically stated that these new hires will fix the 4 broken aspects of the game that I had mentioned and when they will be fixed. If that is public info, please point me towards it.

Their "giving explanation in a constructive way to many of the doubts and about the lack of features" isn't my concern. I know the game lacks features, any fan of X3 knows that X4 lacks features, my concern is the broken existing features and their plan on adding new features before fixing the existing broken features.

A roadmap that includes menton of a DLC and new features without any mention of fixing the major issues in the game .. it feels wrong.
This is a hard post for me to make becuase, I love the X series. I'm simply confused with the direction of this roadmap.

[mopz]

I couldn't agree more. Even on xbtf there was collision damage... Using a carrier with s/m subordinates to attack a station is a tragedy. It feels more than broken...

[EmperorDragon]

The AI is my main concern. The way I play X4 will change when AI commands are fixed (ie: assigning your ships to auto-Explore). But I'm also interested in 3 other things to be fixed: Economy, Warfare and Turrets. Please point me in the direction of the devs admitting that any of these 4 broken aspects of the game are 'broken', 'will be fixed' and 'when they will be fixed'. If you would, it'd make me sooo much happier.

AI is still an issue, although there have been several more improvements to pathfinding, Xenon_Slayer said it will be worth retesting in 2.0 beta 2. I do not know if this entails AI improvements as well or just strictly pathfinding. I am sure we'll get options for collision damage once pathfinding works properly, large ships enter gates from the back for a reason.

Warfare and turrets is being worked on throughout the 2.0 beta, turrets are much, much better in beta 1 already apart from the same poor range. Faction wars work too but needs more attention, will check it out again once beta 2 lands.

Cannot speak for economy, I never had problems with it so I cannot say if anything changed.

I hope this bit of information made you at least somewhat happier for the time being, there's still work to be done but they're getting there, concerns are being addressed.

[Mindstrip]

[...] concerns are being addressed.

Link to devs' statement plz, or do you mean that this is self evident due to the various patches?