Automated ware delivery above the 5 sector limit/shipyards selling shipbuilding resources

[pref]

I've little idea on how I might tweak it further lol.

Let me know if any tweaks are needed, can tell what to change or just explain the expressions so you can do it on your own.
Pretty simple.

[pref]

The mod changes the max allowed values for the range parameters of the trade script (2.), and a double check which ensures that any range values are within the range limit (3.).
The first 4 <replace> tags deal with the parameter values: each param has a param node, to which further <input_param> nodes belong that specify additional settings for the parameter.
We need to change the max values for each 4 params (min/max sell/buy).

The expression below gets the ship's commander's skill in management (if exists), and the ship's pilot's piloting skill, and takes the higher value using the [a, b, ...].max syntax.

Code: Select all

[@this.ship.commander.tradenpc.skill.management, @this.ship.pilot.skill.piloting].max

If you want to tweak the amount you can use arithmetic operations here, like [@this.ship.commander.tradenpc.skill.management, @this.ship.pilot.skill.piloting].max * 2 / 3. The 2.0 vanilla script divides the max value by 3. Take note that the division (/) does the rounding/truncating if the divisor is an integer so max / 3 * 2 might get you different result then max * 2 / 3 - the latter might be closer to what you need.

You can also use an if here if you want to check for the ship having a trade NPC as commander (so you then filter for trade ships assigned to a station that has a manager).
So you could write something like this if you want a different range for ships belonging to a station and free traders - in the example below the range is only divided by 3 in case the ship has no manager assigned, and sets a min 1 cluster range for free traders that retain the 5 cluster limit:

Code: Select all

<replace ...>if @this.ship.commander.tradenpc then [@this.ship.commander.tradenpc.skill.management, @this.ship.pilot.skill.piloting].max else [3, @this.ship.pilot.skill.piloting].max / 3</replace>

Then you change this value for all 6 occurrences, the 4 params, and the 2 range checks.


The sel attribute in the replace tag (there is also add and remove) tells the engine where to look for the node in the script (order.trade.routine) to do the changes.
// means look anywhere in the code,
params/param means look for a <param> node under a <params> node,
[@name="X"] means look for a param node which has a name attribute with a value of "X"
input_param/@value at the end means you want to change the "value" attribute of the input_param node (omitting that /@value would mean changing the whole input_param node).


1. Mod code:

Code: Select all

<?xml version="1.0" encoding="utf-8"?>
<diff> 
  <replace sel="//params/param[@name='minbuy']/input_param[@name='max']/@value">[@this.ship.commander.tradenpc.skill.management, @this.ship.pilot.skill.piloting].max</replace>
  <replace sel="//params/param[@name='minsell']/input_param[@name='max']/@value">[@this.ship.commander.tradenpc.skill.management, @this.ship.pilot.skill.piloting].max</replace>
  <replace sel="//params/param[@name='maxbuy']/input_param[@name='max']/@value">[@this.ship.commander.tradenpc.skill.management, @this.ship.pilot.skill.piloting].max</replace>
  <replace sel="//params/param[@name='maxsell']/input_param[@name='max']/@value">[@this.ship.commander.tradenpc.skill.management, @this.ship.pilot.skill.piloting].max</replace>

  <replace sel="//init/do_if[@value='this.isplayerowned']/set_value[@name='$maxrange' and @exact='[@this.assignedcontrolled.commander.tradenpc.skill.management, @this.assignedcontrolled.pilot.skill.piloting].max / 3']/@exact">[@this.assignedcontrolled.commander.tradenpc.skill.management, @this.assignedcontrolled.pilot.skill.piloting].max</replace>
  <replace sel="//patch/do_if[@value='this.isplayerowned']/set_value[@name='$maxrange' and @exact='[@this.assignedcontrolled.commander.tradenpc.skill.management, @this.assignedcontrolled.pilot.skill.piloting].max / 3']/@exact">[@this.assignedcontrolled.commander.tradenpc.skill.management, @this.assignedcontrolled.pilot.skill.piloting].max</replace>
</diff>

2. The min/max range parameters in vanilla order.trade.routine

Code: Select all

      <param name="minbuy" default="0" type="number" advanced="true" text="{1041, 10066}" comment="Min gate distance to buy. Buy range supported if $minbuy and $maxbuy are provided">
        <input_param name="startvalue" value="0"/>
        <input_param name="min" value="0"/>
        <input_param name="max" value="[([@this.ship.commander.tradenpc.skill.management, @this.ship.pilot.skill.piloting].max / 3) - 1, 0].max"/>
        <input_param name="step" value="1"/>
      </param>
      <param name="maxbuy" default="0" type="number" text="{1041, 10054}" comment="Max gate distance to buy. Buy range supported if $minbuy and $maxbuy are provided">
        <input_param name="startvalue" value="0"/>
        <input_param name="min" value="0"/>
        <input_param name="max" value="[@this.ship.commander.tradenpc.skill.management, @this.ship.pilot.skill.piloting].max / 3"/>
        <input_param name="step" value="1"/>
      </param>
      <param name="minsell" default="0" type="number" advanced="true" text="{1041, 10068}" comment="Min gate distance to sell. Sell range supported if $minsell and $maxsell are provided">
        <input_param name="startvalue" value="0"/>
        <input_param name="min" value="0"/>
        <input_param name="max" value="[([@this.ship.commander.tradenpc.skill.management, @this.ship.pilot.skill.piloting].max / 3) - 1, 0].max"/>
        <input_param name="step" value="1"/>
      </param>
      <param name="maxsell" default="0" type="number" text="{1041, 10057}" comment="Max gate distance to sell. Sell range supported if $minsell and $maxsell are provided">
        <input_param name="startvalue" value="0"/>
        <input_param name="min" value="0"/>
        <input_param name="max" value="[@this.ship.commander.tradenpc.skill.management, @this.ship.pilot.skill.piloting].max / 3"/>
        <input_param name="step" value="1"/>
      </param>

3. The vanilla check for max allowed range (it has 2 occurrences, the other ensures a change during a specific earlier update version)

Code: Select all

    <do_if value="this.isplayerowned">
      <set_value name="$maxrange" exact="[@this.assignedcontrolled.commander.tradenpc.skill.management, @this.assignedcontrolled.pilot.skill.piloting].max / 3"/>
      <do_if value="$minbuy gt [$maxrange - 1, 0].max">
        <edit_order_param order="this.assignedcontrolled.order" param="'minbuy'" value="[$maxrange - 1, 0].max"/>
      </do_if>
      <do_if value="$maxbuy gt $maxrange">
        <edit_order_param order="this.assignedcontrolled.order" param="'maxbuy'" value="$maxrange"/>
      </do_if>
      <do_if value="$minsell gt [$maxrange - 1, 0].max">
        <edit_order_param order="this.assignedcontrolled.order" param="'minsell'" value="[$maxrange - 1, 0].max"/>
      </do_if>
      <do_if value="$maxsell gt $maxrange">
        <edit_order_param order="this.assignedcontrolled.order" param="'maxsell'" value="$maxrange"/>
      </do_if>
      <remove_value name="$maxrange"/>
    </do_if>

Also i was wrong, the change will not affect NPC ships alone - the libraries/jobs.xml contains the ranges for NPC traders, each entry there would have to be changed individually as well.
Like here, the values <param name="maxbuy" value="5"/> <param name="maxsell" value="5"/> would have to be patched for every NPC job unfortunately.

Code: Select all

  <job id="argon_bio_trader_l" name="{20204,1301}">
    <modifiers rebuild="false" commandeerable="true"/>
    <!--<expirationtime min="14400" max="21600" />-->
    <orders>
      <order order="TradeRoutine" default="true">
        <param name="minbuy" value="0"/>
        <param name="maxbuy" value="5"/>
        <param name="minsell" value="0"/>
        <param name="maxsell" value="5"/>
      </order>
    </orders>
    <basket basket="bio"/>
    <category faction="argon" tags="[factionlogic, freighter, trader]" size="ship_l"/>
    <quota galaxy="8" cluster="4"/>
    <location class="galaxy" macro="xu_ep2_universe_macro" faction="argon" relation="member" comparison="ge"/>
    <environment buildatshipyard="true"/>
    <ship>
      <select faction="argon" tags="[trader, container]" size="ship_l"/>
      <loadout>
        <level min="0" max="0.4"/>
      </loadout>
      <owner exact="argon" overridenpc="true"/>
    </ship>
  </job>

[Scoob]

Thanks @pref - I'll have a good read of this when I get a moment.

Scoob.

[Scoob]

I've got a few minutes to have a quick play with this mod, so I've installed it and loaded my game. After un-assigning and re-assigning my two M-Class freighters, they each now show a 14 sector min/max range, which is good - they're only 3.5 and 4 stars, so not maxed out yet.

However, despite my confirming there are stations buying the Microchips I produce at the maximum price of 1,090 credits, the ships aren't actually doing anything currently. In the property view looking at the stations subordinates, they have no trading icon present, nor even show their current sector (the station's home sector) unlike the assigned Mining ships with show both the mining (or trading if they're returning home) icon as well as their current sector.

I'll give it a little time to see if they wake up.

Edit: I left the game running for 10 minutes or so and one of the freighters has just woken up

Scoob.

[Scoob]

Heh, here's something weird, I suspect a vanilla issue...

One of the M-Class Freighters assigned to my station has done something odd. It's gone off, bought Food Rations and is selling them to an NPC station. Food Rations are NOT on this ships lists, only EC's, Silicon and Microchips, the parent station does not use Food. It looks like this ship is free Autotrading, while assigned to a station yet the Captain is only 1.5 Stars. Damn strange lol.

Note: I assign two additional low-star Captain Freighters to my station to see what would happen.

Scoob.

[pref]

It's gone off, bought Food Rations and is selling them to an NPC station. Food Rations are NOT on this ships lists, only EC's, Silicon and Microchips, the parent station does not use Food.

Have you changed the script? Like the min value for min buy/sell for ex?
I can't say if station traders would do such thing in vanilla, i almost exclusively use ATs as station traders act pretty weird in cases.

By the way when you assign a ship to a station from the context menu, the max buy/sell range will be set to [piloting, management].max * 2 in the lib.request.orders script, and the range will be adjusted by the max range check in order.trade.routine. So currently you cannot set a higher range then skill*2 for station traders without patching lib.request.orders as well.

[Scoob]

Have you changed the script? Like the min value for min buy/sell for ex?
I can't say if station traders would do such thing in vanilla, i almost exclusively use ATs as station traders act pretty weird in cases.

By the way when you assign a ship to a station from the context menu, the max buy/sell range will be set to [piloting, management].max * 2 in the lib.request.orders script, and the range will be adjusted by the max range check in order.trade.routine. So currently you cannot set a higher range then skill*2 for station traders without patching lib.request.orders as well.

Nope, not changed anything. I'm wondering now if it perhaps had some left-over Food Rations in it from a prior manual trade or something, I'm really not sure now.

The increased trade ranges are really helping though. Ships aren't ranging as far as in 1.6 of course, but they're actually able to sell the stations produce now at least.

Scoob.

[pref]

Nope, not changed anything. I'm wondering now if it perhaps had some left-over Food Rations in it from a prior manual trade or something, I'm really not sure now.

The increased trade ranges are really helping though. Ships aren't ranging as far as in 1.6 of course, but they're actually able to sell the stations produce now at least.

Scoob.

In case they have leftover cargo that will get sold now, that is normal for station traders as well.
Happy it works for you, hf!

[Scoob]

Happy it works for you, hf!

Thanks, I actually can now my Station is able to sell its produce without micro-management!

Scoob.

[Scoob]

Hi Pref,

So you know if this is still working to extend a sation-assigned traders range?

I have the mod enabled in version 2.5 and when I look at one of my experienced (four star) Captains, it shows a max distance of 4 / 13 but the slider cannot be dragged to enable him to actually travel any further than the default 4, limiting his usefulness quite substantially. As a result, I'm once again manually ordering ships to buy from my station, then sell to an NPC one rather than having it automated.

Hope you can work your magic again.

Cheers,

Scoob.

[Imperial Good]

To make it clear to people, the 5 limit range is gates/orbital accelerators and not super highways. This means sector clusters such as Grand Exchange all count as 1. Hence a station inside grand exchange can access 3 sectors of market (All 3 Grand Exchanges) with 0 range used. 1 range gets one the entirety of Blackhole Sun (another 2 sectors), all of Nopelios' Fortune (another 2 sectors), Path to Profit and Eighteen Billion.

I could list this for all range tiers but it would waste time. Instead at 5 range I will list the sectors not reached from a station anywhere in Grand Exchange with 5 range.

• Lasting Vengence
• Atiya's Misfortune
• Matrix #9
• Hewa's Twin 3/4
• Hewa's Twin 5
• Company Regard
• Scaleplate Green

3 of these systems are originally owned by the Xenon and 4 of them are the obscure Hewa's Twin branch (badly positioned for access from Grand Exchange).

[nickolaiproblem]

As the new ranges appear to largely be Stars = Range, a way to rebalance that would be a quick fix. Sadly I had zero X4 modding experience, so wouldn't know where to start looking.

Basically, rather than the current system of (guessing a bit here) of one Star = one Sector, I'd love to edit this out to one Star = three Sectors, two Stars = six Sectors, three Stars = nine Sectors etc. etc. or something along those lines.

Scoob.

Made a quick change for this, range = skill (pilot/management), not skill/3.
TradeRangeIncrease mod

Can't test it much because i get CTD in 30 mins tops, but should work if no other mod changes the affected trade script. Had a ship selling with it from nopileos to the ANT wharf so they do pick targets further away.

Though it is really insufficient, there should be a way to control ware flow in much more detail.

Can you make an official post about this mod. It seems pretty interesting and I think other players might like it.

[nickolaiproblem]

I have seen some posts over at beta forum that player complexes with ship building related modules will not sell ship building resources any more.
Is this an intended change or a bug?

How are we supposed to get our wares outside the max 5 sector radius without having to manually do trade runs constantly then?

I was hoping i could create warehouses which would buy wares of my production complex, and resell them to nearby shipyards. But since endproducts cannot be bought, for this it is a must to have a dock/wharf on the warehouse to turn endproducts into resources.
If these stations will not sell the wares because of that then i see no way to manage logistics in an acceptable manner..

I'd be curious what else options i have then?
I'd really prefer having production centralised in my own space, much more flexible solution in case a relation change happens with any race. Also there are less issues with AI config, less time spent in map and more in my spaceship, less time spent on the employee skill misery, generally more effective with build time and costs, and also i just love the space cities this game made possible to create.

My last hope with this 5 sector trade limit was that i can build logistic centres around the galaxy which are just empty warehouses with an EQ dock attached and config some ATs on them so the wares can reach shipyards further away, but this seems to be impossible now

Also if you check modded section there is a mod for warehouses and trade stations by legion of one

[Scoob]

I'm using this mod with 2.5, yet it no longer appears to work. My ships will show a higher potential range, but they only use vanilla ranges. I.e. I have some four star Captains that show "4 / 13" range on the range slider, however the range slider is greyed out so they're stuck at just travelling four gates.

To be clear, even when picking quite a central location for a station, a range of 5 is not enough to trade everwhere automatically. I really wish this dumb limitation was officially removed. Being forced to manually order my freighters around is ridiculous. Pref's changes did appear to fix this issue nicely for me in my prior game. However, starting afresh in 2.5 sees his tweaks not working.

Hopefully, if he's still interested, he'll pop back on this thread. Sadly, X4 modding is beyond me currently.

Scoob.

[LegionOfOne]

Given your problems, I think you would love my Mules and Warehouses mod.

It solves every problem I ever encountered trying to supply my own stations, shipyards, station construction sites, allows the creation of warehouses, and so much more

The code is quite short and runs very fast too, because Mules don't care about money or profits, just moving wares. Since they mostly trade between player objects, why would they care ?

They can still be used very effectively to sell to other factions, but it is better when the wares you sell have been made from scratch from raw resources you mined, not from wares bought from other factions.
That way, it is pure profit, and the fact the Mules don't bother with prices is not an issue.

Feel free to look at / borrow / rewrite the code for your own specific needs.
That's what I did originally, this mod started from the StationMule by leecarter.

[Scoob]

Thanks, I might try that. I just wanted my Freighters to not be nerfed by the daft range reduction change - it really broke my game and ruined much of the joy of owning a profit-making Station for me.

Scoob.

[Scoob]

I just had a quick look at pref's script. It seems it makes changes to maxrange only, which of course did work fine. However, while the increased maxrange can be seen in-game, it's part of a greyed-out slider with Minrange being the skill level in stars. I would try to tweak this to adjust minrange too, but I think that might have other consequences.

Why ES made this change in the first place is a mystery, and why it's subsequently been tweaked again, which has broken this great mod, is a mystery too.

I LOVE building large stations to supply the whole galaxy with resources, it's fun. Now my station can only reach a fraction of it. Not fun.

Scoob.

[pref]

I just had a quick look at pref's script. It seems it makes changes to maxrange only, which of course did work fine. However, while the increased maxrange can be seen in-game, it's part of a greyed-out slider with Minrange being the skill level in stars. I would try to tweak this to adjust minrange too, but I think that might have other consequences.

Why ES made this change in the first place is a mystery, and why it's subsequently been tweaked again, which has broken this great mod, is a mystery too.

I LOVE building large stations to supply the whole galaxy with resources, it's fun. Now my station can only reach a fraction of it. Not fun.

Scoob.

Hey Scoob!

Is this still of any relevance to you or anyone else?
I never launched the game since, but can take a look if needed. I tested the stuff back then, it worked (have seen ships go autotrade beyond the vanilla limit). Regarding tweaking it i think there was a min/max calculation for both min and max range or something like that, it could be confusing a bit.
Quite possible a patch since then caused it to not function any more.

[pref]

Given your problems, I think you would love my Mules and Warehouses mod.

It solves every problem I ever encountered trying to supply my own stations, shipyards, station construction sites, allows the creation of warehouses, and so much more

Thanks for your work

The game really needs proper trade scripts that allow player to distribute and sell stuff with proper config options.
It's beyond me how could they release the game without such scripts, eco aspect suffers so bad without.. half the fun in X3 was creating the trade network for me, the other being boarding

The range increase does not help much to be honest as the logic by which ATs pick trades is insufficient. Even with this mod allowing a high trade range i had to go out of my way to force a ship to pick a deal that actually made sense volume and profit wise instead of wasting my time with a 5x delivery to the neighbouring sector..

Will check on your stuff if it's still supported when the split come.

[Scoob]

Hey Scoob!

Is this still of any relevance to you or anyone else?
I never launched the game since, but can take a look if needed. I tested the stuff back then, it worked (have seen ships go autotrade beyond the vanilla limit). Regarding tweaking it i think there was a min/max calculation for both min and max range or something like that, it could be confusing a bit.
Quite possible a patch since then caused it to not function any more.

Hey pref,

I appreciate you taking the time to respond. Don't worry too much if you're not really interested in the game currently, I'll survive lol.

I agree with you when you say the game should have shipped with "proper" scripts for trading. To me, it's a gaping hole in the game that they are missing / not up to standard. Everything seems to be placed under the control of the Station Manager AI, yet this AI really isn't very good at all. Constant resource short-falls while the AI seems to go crazy on *one* ware, they *wrong* ware, and the huge pauses between taking sell opportunities, despite a market starved for a given ware. It's VERY frustrating. The AI improving over time is something I hope for, but I'd be far far happier to be able to actually control my ships. I.e. ONLY buy this, ONLY sell this, buy these etc. etc. to specifically assign vessels to a given ware.

BUILD. FIGHT. TRADE. THINK.

Build - I can do that, it's pretty damn good. AI needs practise.
Fight - I can do that too, though the AI is a little lacking at times.
Trade - I can do it and make pretty good profits from manually ordered trades. The AI sucks, and stations can't even keep themselves fed / sell high-demand items reliably.
Think - the AI isn't doing this!

Scoob.