Anyone hit xtreme ranks yet? - Fight progress improvement in a future build.

[grapedog]

SETA was great when there wasn't a travel drive... but there is travel drive now.

And now with the travel drive fleets can not use it right? At least SETA affects the whole X Universe, so, travel with the least fast of the fleet's ships (mainly the flagship), do not enter travel drive, no autopilot and use SETA if you want the Fleet to be moving synchronised!!! And in doing so wish that Egosoft would "reinvent" the jump drive...

They certainly need to fix how fleets fly together... and if you spend that much time flying around aimlessly with a fleet following you, then have at it. I'm not trying to have SETA removed, though I wouldn't care if they did.

Do you feel SETA and Mods should be removed?

Edit: 3 lines of code, 15 letters - that's all it takes to own a Xenon Carrier. "Editing" is child's playing X4 if a person desires.

I don't think they should be removed, but anchoring an achievement around using SETA while AFK is stupid.

Then by default you must also believe the same about Mod's.

Using SETA doesn't mark a game as "modified" because SETA is an essential part of the game, otherwise SETA would've been removed a long time ago. Currently, I've not once seen an achievement anchored around SETA, nor have I found one easier to get with SETA then (for example) with a Mod's. If a person doesn't wish to "modify" their game but still wishes to get an achievement requiring 2 billion kills then they have little choice.

Yes, I believe that you shouldn't anchor achievements around mods as well. That's just silly....

SETA WAS an essential part of the game before travel drive.... and you're not getting 2 billion kills in SETA, because that doesn't work. I don't have a problem with SETA in the game, I have an issue with one poster mentioning tying it into achievements, like you need to use it to reach a certain milestone. If that's the case, then the achievement is broken. SETA shouldn't be required for anything, outside of an individuals desire to use it for whatever reason they chose. But don't force people who don't like it to use it, to use it in order to achieve something.

[pref]

It's not tied to seta or anything, fight rank is impossible, period. If you got it before ES has a pass on the requirements it's obviously a result of hacking the save signature.
When ES balances the requirements (guess that's going to happen based on how steam stats change for the playerbase) then you can get that additional sentence popping up.. or use the linked hack if you really can't wait.

Trade rank should be possible but It's not just seta, you'd have to do things that are really far from any kind of normal gameplay.

[dtpsprt]

SETA was great when there wasn't a travel drive... but there is travel drive now.

And now with the travel drive fleets can not use it right? At least SETA affects the whole X Universe, so, travel with the least fast of the fleet's ships (mainly the flagship), do not enter travel drive, no autopilot and use SETA if you want the Fleet to be moving synchronised!!! And in doing so wish that Egosoft would "reinvent" the jump drive...

They certainly need to fix how fleets fly together... and if you spend that much time flying around aimlessly with a fleet following you, then have at it. I'm not trying to have SETA removed, though I wouldn't care if they did.

That's the whole point grapedog... The fleet movement can not be fixed while travel drive exists and is used. This leaves two options:

a) make traveldrive optional in use (by a command) and one can "drive" their whole fleet using SETA

b) reintroduce the Jump drive [less optimal since the fleets will jump to the system of choice but from their jump point to travel to where they need to be it's still the same and requires option a) one way or the other].

Anyway traveldrive was the worst thing Egosoft thought of, probably jealous of Elite that has it, but they forgot that there is no such thing a a fleet commanded by the player (therefore AI's) in that game... and STILL they will not accept it and mend (same as with the skill leveling).

[dtpsprt]

It's not tied to seta or anything, fight rank is impossible, period. If you got it before ES has a pass on the requirements it's obviously a result of hacking the save signature.
When ES balances the requirements (guess that's going to happen based on how steam stats change for the playerbase) then you can get that additional sentence popping up.. or use the linked hack if you really can't wait.

Trade rank should be possible but It's not just seta, you'd have to do things that are really far from any kind of normal gameplay.

Tbh, I believe that X-TREME Fighter is more achievable than X-TREME trader as it is with the use of SETA and 3-4 well positioned and equipped fleets.

My proposal (If I had a say) would be for the Fighter achievement to be totally personal and in "real" levels of course, something like 3,000 personal kills and 1,000 boardings. thus eliminating the use of SETA as a way to it and be (I believe) gratifying for the player to show off.
As for the Trader? That's way more complex but I would prefer something based in overall performance and keen enterpreneurial sense like 500 million credits per hour average profit (total profit made divided by the hours of gameplay)!!!

[CaptainRAVE]

It's not tied to seta or anything, fight rank is impossible, period. If you got it before ES has a pass on the requirements it's obviously a result of hacking the save signature.
When ES balances the requirements (guess that's going to happen based on how steam stats change for the playerbase) then you can get that additional sentence popping up.. or use the linked hack if you really can't wait.

Trade rank should be possible but It's not just seta, you'd have to do things that are really far from any kind of normal gameplay.

Tbh, I believe that X-TREME Fighter is more achievable than X-TREME trader as it is with the use of SETA and 3-4 well positioned and equipped fleets.

Not really seeing as apparently kills from fleets and oos don’t count. Seta in sector will get disrupted as soon as you enter combat. Xtreme fighter is impossible without mods/cheats.

[grapedog]

That's the whole point grapedog... The fleet movement can not be fixed while travel drive exists and is used. This leaves two options:

a) make traveldrive optional in use (by a command) and one can "drive" their whole fleet using SETA

b) reintroduce the Jump drive [less optimal since the fleets will jump to the system of choice but from their jump point to travel to where they need to be it's still the same and requires option a) one way or the other].

Anyway traveldrive was the worst thing Egosoft thought of, probably jealous of Elite that has it, but they forgot that there is no such thing a a fleet commanded by the player (therefore AI's) in that game... and STILL they will not accept it and mend (same as with the skill leveling).

why can't fleet movement be improved, and still have travel drive?

Travel drive was one of the best things Egosoft put into the game.

[Ezarkal]

The fleet movement can not be fixed while travel drive exists and is used.

Disagree! My destroyer fleets do try to stay in formation when using travel drive. It's quite a sight.
Although it IS quite rare, and I agree it's behavior we should see more often.

[dtpsprt]

why can't fleet movement be improved, and still have travel drive?

Travel drive was one of the best things Egosoft put into the game.

Because every ship according to it's mass, geometry and engines has different travel drive velocity. To top all, max speed (also dependent on these parameters) must first be achieved before entering travel drive.
That's twice the conundrum right? The only "solution" to this without ditching travel drive entirely it's to change it's mechanics so that when in a fleet formation (either flagship or escort) travel drive will be the one used by the slowest ship.

Of course these calculations leave out the pilot factor. Seriously you can not expect a 1 or 2 star pilot to be able to follow orders as a 3, 4 or even 5 star right? (This was well taken care of in X2/X3, because there were no pilots and skills, just computers following orders. Only the Autotraders had pilots, who gained experience over time and successful deals allowing them to expand their trade and finally become global traders, able to crisscross the X Universe. And that was not dependent on any dice roll!!!).

So, for coordinated flight, we need a system that "slaves" all drives to one which must be able to vary it's speed if it's not the slowest one, so that everybody can follow. Something like the mechanic that allowed slaving of the jump drives in X2/X3 to the flagship.
Surely one can do it "believable" when talking about the hypothetical Jump Drive but in "normal" travel, where Uncle Newton reigns, there's havoc to follow for sure... Even with the Jump Drive mechanics (since they required Energy Cells to jump) it was not possible for all ships to follow in long jumps, so the player had to calculate "steps" and allow for Energy Cell refuelling, which meant choose friendly or neutral systems with Solar Power plants in them (they were not in any system)...

To program, test and optimize such algorithms (with the travel drive present) they MAY be implemented in X5... it'll take a year for sure, including the Beta period (hopefully not a 1 day period like with 3.10 which, I believe, was made so in order to get a place in the Guinness Book of Records).

[dtpsprt]

Disagree! My destroyer fleets do try to stay in formation when using travel drive. It's quite a sight.
Although it IS quite rare, and I agree it's behavior we should see more often.

Like you said, they try... please read my (science based) explanation to grapedog on why this is not possible. There is even a "small" dice roll (chance) that two ships built in the same shipyard at the same time with the same configuration, even having the same modifications will vary in some aspects (as the devs admitted) taking into consideration that the ingredients used can not be identical. This is the reason that if you look at the modifications data there is no standard percentage in improvement of performance.

So, the longer the trip, the worst the formation will be broken (again without accounting for difference in piloting skills)....

EDIT: I totally agree with your "signature" BTW

[Ebany]

All said and done, Xtreme Fighter is actually unobtainable because of a bug in X4. Until Egosoft fix this no-one's getting it without doing a little "modding".

[grapedog]

Id love if travel drive could match speeds. Would make fleet formation flying easier, and would mean i wouldn't have to love tap a friendly target to get it out of travel drive to scan it or interact with it beyond comms.

Though the only time my fleets don't stay in formation is when travel driving or moving to a new sector. Othereise they're always in formation.

[dtpsprt]

Id love if travel drive could match speeds. Would make fleet formation flying easier, and would mean i wouldn't have to love tap a friendly target to get it out of travel drive to scan it or interact with it beyond comms.

Though the only time my fleets don't stay in formation is when travel driving or moving to a new sector. Othereise they're always in formation.

For this to happen the whole core of the traveldrive mechanics needs to change.
I've noticed (yes, I don't lave the computer while the game is playing) that what's happening when moving in sector (where they keep a sample of formation) is that the traveldrive is constantly activating and deactivating. Too much noise for nothing, then, when the Fleet passes a gate or an accelerator the lead ship stops and waits for the rest to come, form and continue. Of course they do not use highways.
This results in a lot of noise that we have to endure for a long time (no SETA because of traveldrive activating every 3 sec).

I do know that (almost) everything is in the eye (also time and ear) of the beholder, but I find this a bit "thick"... This is why everybody is complaining about fleet formation and motion not working correctly.

The existing "medicine" for this is static Fleets... this means some 10-20 Fleets "strategically" positioned to repel attackers (mostly Xenon), without a chance in a million to move them from one sector to another (OK, maybe the next), leading to hundreds (even thousands) of ships which, as you have put in another post, is "bloating" the save file making save and load a tiresome experience at least...

P.S. I love massive Fleet battle but let them all come to one place and shoot it out right?

[CBJ]

Can we stay on topic in this thread, please? There are plenty of other topics about fleets, travel and SETA; this one is about rankings.

[dtpsprt]

Can we stay on topic in this thread, please? There are plenty of other topics about fleets, travel and SETA; this one is about rankings.

Very true, but eventually the thread will drift that way as achieving ranks (especially X-TREME) has to do with all these off topic subjects a lot.

[jlehtone]

Not necessarily.

The title question is a yes|no case. Not much to speculate. My answer is 'no' on both ranks. As of yesterday I own now whole two ships in my game. Quite satisfied about the first ingame day.

There is technical background info to reveal:
* rank X requires sum(something)>=Y
* action Z adds W points to the sum
* action S removes T points from the sum
and apparently:
* bug: K + 1 is not more than K, when K is ...

Whether the {X, Y}, {Z, W}, and {S, T} tables belong here, to spoilers, to wiki, or to manual ...


The revelation that ranks are not achievable makes my vanilla X3 recipe crumble:

1. Get Xtreme Fight
2. Start playing
3. Start killing
4. Start trading

Then again, X3 gave some perks to the holder of rank, but it is the thought that counts.

[Ebany]

CBJ was correct, we're getting off-topic.

So to answer the op's question, I'm:
Trade Rank: Xtreme
Fight Rank: Commander

Been stuck on Commander for thousands of hours on 2 separate computers, game's bugged.

[CaptainRAVE]

CBJ was correct, we're getting off-topic.

So to answer the op's question, I'm:
Trade Rank: Xtreme
Fight Rank: Commander

Been stuck on Commander for thousands of hours on 2 separate computers, game's bugged.

How long did it take you to get to Xtreme trader? How much cash? How many stations?

[Ebany]

How long did it take you to get to Xtreme trader? How much cash? How many stations?

I'm honestly not sure how long it took, I stopped tracking ranks once I realised ship kills were only taken into account if I did them personally. After a while we stop dogfighting in small ships as we have Defence Platforms and Fleets doing the work for us while we focus on things like station building, what was the point watching rank if those kills don't count. It was after a game patch I got the achievement, must have come through during saved game load when I was off getting a coffee as I didn't see it till I quit the game and noticed it on GOG. Currently I have stations worth about 12 billion and ships worth about 3 billion with about 7 billion in free cash.
From what I've read we need a trade/fight score of 2.6 billion to get Xtreme, but we can't actually see our "score" in statistics so it's hard to know.

[grapedog]

That seems weird, as I have over I think 90 billion in net worth... and I'm at rank 22 I think towards XTreme Trader...

[CaptainRAVE]

How long did it take you to get to Xtreme trader? How much cash? How many stations?

I'm honestly not sure how long it took, I stopped tracking ranks once I realised ship kills were only taken into account if I did them personally. After a while we stop dogfighting in small ships as we have Defence Platforms and Fleets doing the work for us while we focus on things like station building, what was the point watching rank if those kills don't count. It was after a game patch I got the achievement, must have come through during saved game load when I was off getting a coffee as I didn't see it till I quit the game and noticed it on GOG. Currently I have stations worth about 12 billion and ships worth about 3 billion with about 7 billion in free cash.
From what I've read we need a trade/fight score of 2.6 billion to get Xtreme, but we can't actually see our "score" in statistics so it's hard to know.

How can you have the trader achievement with so few credits? I know there are other ways to level it, but all of them would result in a lot more credits. Is your game modded?