Big massive ships have less mass/inertia than drones.

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Mr.Killer
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Big massive ships have less mass/inertia than drones.

Post by Mr.Killer » Wed, 9. Sep 20, 22:11

So I was taking a fight to a enemy, when all of a sudden I was launched lateral to the right a few 100 meters, like a gigantic ship flew into my behemoth....
Now I had this thing a long time ago, between version 2 and this one, when I had a lot mods active.... flying one of the largest ships and being pushed away by small ships. So I dug into the maker of these mods and argued about it, until they said that they did nothing about the gravity or the mass settings.....

Now this event occurred, me being pushed away beyond reason, and now you want to know what that reason was? A DEFENCE DRONE !!!!!!!!

I really did not know they had more mass than a behemoth........
Egosoft, please take care of these little illogical things? for me? please?

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ezra-r
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Re: And then this happened

Post by ezra-r » Wed, 9. Sep 20, 22:33

I don't think there is nothing to fix. You were flying a Behemoth and a Split defense drone pushed you like the piece of slime your ship is... You pitiful Argon! :split:

:lol:

leoriq
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Re: And then this happened

Post by leoriq » Wed, 9. Sep 20, 22:45

Defense Drone Stronk!
Signature yes signature a GIGANTIC SIGNATURE!!

jlehtone
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Re: And then this happened

Post by jlehtone » Wed, 9. Sep 20, 23:58

Hasn't peculiar small and fast vs. big and slow physics been a corner-stone of X Universe? :goner:
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Mr.Killer
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Re: And then this happened

Post by Mr.Killer » Thu, 10. Sep 20, 09:40

Ha ha ha, nice replies you guys...... 8)

Thus I was thinking why we not can fly those drones, they bump every thing out of the way!!!! Perfect for harassing Xenons....

but serious guys, have you not noticed this behavior? Have you not seen weird corners a ship can make when auto-pilot is on? Flying at 3.5 Km per second and trying to maintain that speed and make a curve to the next gate? The auto pilot takes over and it can easily fly that same speed sideways or even backwards....(result: it gets through the gate without fuzz). Not fair, not logical, defies all laws of X, - something.....
And I did not mention the fact that the pilot of your big ship can fly straight through any moon sized asteroid without even stopping, and if you pilot the ship, even a little bug (if it was possible, but hey, it is X4, everything is possible) can stop your ship dead in its track. :?

So, are we agreed on these weird anomalies? Do we want them to keep appearing? or do we want a little bit of reality in this sci-fi game????

Mr.Killer
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Re: And then this happened

Post by Mr.Killer » Thu, 10. Sep 20, 09:44

ezra-r wrote:
Wed, 9. Sep 20, 22:33
I don't think there is nothing to fix. You were flying a Behemoth and a Split defense drone pushed you like the piece of slime your ship is... You pitiful Argon! :split:

:lol:
you are guessing I was Argon? Shame on you, I am a proud Split and call me not one of those stupid over-aggressive Argon dudes.

:lol:

de_flipkabouter
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Re: And then this happened

Post by de_flipkabouter » Thu, 10. Sep 20, 12:46

I must say i have seen similar things.

When standing on the bridge and letting my captain do the flying she tends to go all out 'ramming speed' towards a gate in travel mode.
Aiming right next to it, then right before missing the mark makes an impossible turn at speeds i could not manage myself to make the jump. Most times it also looks like we are about to ram into the rim of the gate but somehow make it through with some clipping.

I dont mind this tbh, i rather make it through opposed to busting my ship open and piss off the galaxy with intent to destroy a gate medieval style :P

What i do mind sometimes is a docking command to a factory a few gates out to have my captain just idle around the factory, again looking like we are going to plunge in at lightspeed then make some erratic turns and conclude 'it just cant be done, lets have some coffee and hang out'.

With respect to the dev team though, these things probably arent easy to streamline without adding a metric ton of waypoints on different dimensions.

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EGO_Aut
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Re: And then this happened

Post by EGO_Aut » Thu, 10. Sep 20, 13:01

Anyone who complains ever used "shift+space"?

Mr.Killer
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Re: And then this happened

Post by Mr.Killer » Thu, 10. Sep 20, 13:04

LOL, yeah, I recognize the moves very well, sometimes I stand behind a captain just to let time pass, and see how he/she does it, then I crumble and brace for impact (while I am not really there) and just in a nick of time it maneuvers the right way....without a scratch...
Or they need another direction to go to, and then I give 'm some that needs steering to the left (as an example) and the captain finishes his coffee first, step on the pedal, turn slowly to the right, orders a fresh cup of coffee, with milk, yes, oh, and a bit of sugar... don't forget to stir..... and after that finally it is pointing somewhat in the right direction - ish.... Makes me sometimes laugh and sometimes cry when I need the crew to respond fast......
Or, starting the travel mode but keep the speed under 50 km/s, slower than normal speed, to wait for ...... what?!?.... I have no clue..... when taking over, the autopilot does similar moves, and when pressing shift A, the ship shoots away like a bullet out of a gun (sort of)
So these fun parts are either English humor or bad German gründlichkeit... Make some of it....

But I still believe in the power of men, that men can do anything he wants, just by focusing on the task ahead.... So this EGOSOFT team, they can do great things, I know, I believe in them!!! Come on guys! Show us your magic!!!!! :wink:

EDIT: Ofcourse the captain waits for the entire fleet, but, come on, you can do better......

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Re: And then this happened

Post by Mr.Killer » Thu, 10. Sep 20, 13:07

EGO_Aut wrote:
Thu, 10. Sep 20, 13:01
Anyone who complains ever used "shift+space"?
ehm, scroll the wheel a bit (speed) or tap onthe Z or X key to influence the speed, that will make it better and not stay drifting like a junior F&F driver...


(Scroll the wheel???? It is a space ship yes!!!!!!!!) :lol: :lol: :lol:

Mr.Killer
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Re: And then this happened

Post by Mr.Killer » Sun, 13. Sep 20, 12:54

..... and no member of EGOSOFT develop team is going to reply?

too bad, this happens, it should not, trying to destroy the big turrets on a Xenon-K, pinpointing with the precision we have (virtually none) shooting my main battery at the 'K', then while drones try to repair.... I don't know, but buzzing all around me (at that point I have no damage to shields or hull, but they still want to 'repair', and pushing me away as if this is the normal way to fly, repair, whatever....
So annoying that the MASS of my behemoth is less than a drone (of which I have a few of them onboard)

Egosoft, please, change this to normal understandable and characteristics as it was supposed to be, this is a flaw, a huge one.

Falcrack
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Re: And then this happened

Post by Falcrack » Sun, 13. Sep 20, 18:41

Mr.Killer wrote:
Sun, 13. Sep 20, 12:54
..... and no member of EGOSOFT develop team is going to reply?
Make a report in "X4:Foundations - Technical Support" or "X4:Foundations - Public Beta Feedback". Provide a save file if possible where this situation is likely to occur and detailed steps to reproduce (though probably not going to be able to reproduce this in a hundred hours of gameplay, it just sounds too random)

Alan Phipps
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Re: And then this happened

Post by Alan Phipps » Sun, 13. Sep 20, 20:16

A further hint if you want the *right* dev to notice an issue is to give the report thread a descriptive title that shows what type of issue it is.
A dog has a master; a cat has domestic staff.

Mr.Killer
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Re: And then this happened

Post by Mr.Killer » Wed, 16. Sep 20, 22:33

Falcrack wrote:
Sun, 13. Sep 20, 18:41
Mr.Killer wrote:
Sun, 13. Sep 20, 12:54
..... and no member of EGOSOFT develop team is going to reply?
Make a report in "X4:Foundations - Technical Support" or "X4:Foundations - Public Beta Feedback". Provide a save file if possible where this situation is likely to occur and detailed steps to reproduce (though probably not going to be able to reproduce this in a hundred hours of gameplay, it just sounds too random)
All well and so, but step in any savegame anyone can provide (hell, even my old savegames were used by them) and youll see for yourself... Now do not tell me that you guys never noticed this, it is broken since the beginning of X4 (2018??) So actually, I am not telling something new, the devs can open up the game and there it will show the defect, even in a Raptor I get pushed away by ships all the time....

So, You know now, and If I need to make a new item on this? Your connection is a bit shorter (Mr Phipps) it is more likely you can send this to them a lot faster than me on a forum.....

It is not that I am not willing, but reading coincidental this thread again, and saw your reaction, I found myself not capable to do as you asked, I struggle with some pain at this moment. Maybe in a week..... :cry:

Mr.Killer
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Big massive ships have less mass.....

Post by Mr.Killer » Wed, 30. Sep 20, 20:35

I hope this catches the eyes of the devs, because I did not get a real response, only one useful to put the subject a bit different in the view...

So I was taking a fight to this enemy, when all of a sudden I was launched lateral to the right a few 100 meters, like a gigantic ship flew into my behemoth....
Now I had this thing a long time ago, between version 2 and this one, when I had a lot mods active.... flying one of the largest ships and being pushed away by small ships. So I dug into the maker of these mods and argued about it, until they said that they did nothing about the gravity or the mass settings.....

Now this event occurred, me being pushed away beyond reason, and now you want to know what that reason was? A DEFENCE DRONE !!!!!!!!

I really did not know they had more mass than a behemoth........
Egosoft, please take care of these little illogical things? for me? please?

After a few weeks I found a very simple way to show this for anyone to try. Make some money, buy a Raptor (have to be in that area for that) fill it up with chimera's, go into enemy territory, has all chimera's on intercept mode and try to maneuver or even reach travelspeed... Good chance that it looks like your hardware is default because some shithead in a chimera finds it funny to land and lift-off all the time or get stuck in your bulkhead and forcing in battle to a dead stop... Nice job a- hole! (remember to fire that guy)(if I survive this)

So, how big the ship is, makes no difference to small vessels or even drones, they can stop ANYTHING!!!!!!!! (Should not happen hey devs?)

Einstein would shake his head and mumbles E=MC2... learn people, learn......

<Threads merged and thread title changed. Alan Phipps>

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Re: Big massive ships have less mass/inertia than drones.

Post by LameFox » Thu, 1. Oct 20, 06:20

This really needs a fix. I can't fly my own capships after battle because THEIR OWN REPAIR DRONES keep breaking travel drive.

Also every time I ever board an L or XL ship I have to fly/teleport away and have an AI fly it because it keeps "ramming" something... probably the wrecks of drone stuck inside it.
***modified***

Imperial Good
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Re: Big massive ships have less mass/inertia than drones.

Post by Imperial Good » Thu, 1. Oct 20, 10:22

I have shot down hundreds of defence drones in a Raptor. Did not move the Raptor a single inch.
LameFox wrote:
Thu, 1. Oct 20, 06:20
This really needs a fix. I can't fly my own capships after battle because THEIR OWN REPAIR DRONES keep breaking travel drive.
Would be nice if the repair drones did not interfere with ship operation while in sector, like they behave in low attention.

If you modify ship speed with exceptional mods you end up in the degenerate situation where simply flying causes you to leave your repair drones behind which eventually self-destruct.

Mr.Killer
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Re: And then this happened

Post by Mr.Killer » Thu, 1. Oct 20, 10:53

Alan Phipps wrote:
Sun, 13. Sep 20, 20:16
A further hint if you want the *right* dev to notice an issue is to give the report thread a descriptive title that shows what type of issue it is.
So, I did, still, no response from any of the dev team like...: "Ah sir, that is a good idea, we were so busy making loads of f-u-n.. ehm, we will work on that, because that should not happen!!!"

But, there is no other way to report these mishaps, as any normal person would give a response to a viable problem in the software, and repair it.... So, I'm waiting for them to react on how this goes further...

PS. I do not mean to disrespect anyone of the team, I just would be very happy if they at least recognize this/my problem and confirm it. This way I am relieved and no longer need to worry, knowing this is under their attention.... (because this is the only way to let them know scrolling through megabytes of text, a lot is useless, and a few bits not... find that....... :gruebel: )

Mr.Killer
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Re: Big massive ships have less mass/inertia than drones.

Post by Mr.Killer » Thu, 1. Oct 20, 10:59

Imperial Good wrote:
Thu, 1. Oct 20, 10:22
I have shot down hundreds of defence drones in a Raptor. Did not move the Raptor a single inch.
LameFox wrote:
Thu, 1. Oct 20, 06:20
This really needs a fix. I can't fly my own capships after battle because THEIR OWN REPAIR DRONES keep breaking travel drive.
Would be nice if the repair drones did not interfere with ship operation while in sector, like they behave in low attention.

If you modify ship speed with exceptional mods you end up in the degenerate situation where simply flying causes you to leave your repair drones behind which eventually self-destruct.
Yes, also a mistake in the game. Piloting a big ship through grains of sand keeps both travel mode and seta mode unusable. If I turn the helm over to the pilot, they can, and if I would step in a small ship close to the big one, activate SETA..... all of a sudden it DOES work..... Now, hows that fair.... Only scan modes can operate flying through a small moon, but seta not? there is no correlation between them as far as I can tell.... It is a mode to speed up time, time has nothing to do with ships, drones, sand, or moons to fly through (a bit overdone, I know...).

As I write this, my monitor flew through a minefield the size of a large station or two, I took it to a halt to let the repair drones repair, but SETA mode keeps quitting as I wanted to speed up the repair proces... I am hanging silent in the vacuum of space, so SETA should work, and yet it does not!!!!
So either we have a bug up our rear end, or you, mr Imperial Good, are using another, better working version..... We depend on steam (I do!) so it is what the devs give us, we only report problems that not one or two, but a lot of us have....
All the more reason to DO SOMETHING ABOUT THESE PROBLEMS !!!!!! Sorry for yelling...

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Re: Big massive ships have less mass/inertia than drones.

Post by LameFox » Thu, 1. Oct 20, 12:14

lol I forgot about SETA. I don't use it much but I also have had drones break it, when the ship is not even moving. How they do this, I don't know.
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