[4.0 HF3 - COH + SV] Xenon not sending materials to build stations

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Vilmu
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[4.0 HF3 - COH + SV] Xenon not sending materials to build stations

Post by Vilmu » Thu, 15. Apr 21, 20:35

Issue:
Xenon doesn't send minerals to stations they're trying to build.
Locations: Company Regard & Turquoise Sea (in-case of the provided save).
Duration(s):
Turquoise Sea have been neutral for 4hours 26mins, according to my logbook (that's when I lost teladi reputation as I destroyed admin modules). Prior to that it was Teladi owned and the same unbuilt stations had been there for about 4+ hours already.
Company Regard was neutral for ~1 hour, starting from the same 4hours 26mins ago mentioned above, but Teladi managed to repair the module. Xenon stations there were placed around the same time as in T-Sea.
Both sectors have been waiting for minerals for ~8-10hours with their current stations. Many were destroyed before TEL lost access to sectors, predecessor-stations to these didn't get any miners either, sometimes being there for multiple hours only to be destroyed by kha'ak or a random TEL fighter.
No miners seem interested on those station. Few have tried to travel to Matrix #9, possibly to deliver materials to shipyard/wharf in there.

Has possibly been happening from the very start of the game. I only just started paying some attention to it with better vision of it.

Game duration: Somewhere around 250 hours.

What has been done in the save:
All plots finished.
TER vs. ARG/ANT war is active (to reduce intervention fleets that make it to xenon sectors).
United Paranid is at war with everyone (to block TEL access from scale plate and further reduce intervention fleets)
CUB was victorious in Split plot (shouldn't affect the Xenon much overall).

Possible causes:
- Specific situation created with the sector count : shipyard/wharf ratio, making their miners unable to keep up with the demand, this leading to no minerals being delivered to build stations.
- Shipyard/wharf priority too high.
- Not able to build enough miners.
- Mineral availability in sector.
- Maybe combinations of multiple ones above.

This makes the Xenon unable to expand and fail even re-taking lost sectors. If it's a thing that has been present from the start, it would explain why Xenon has been feeling so passive in 4.0 / have not gained a single sector since the start of the game.


Save ( slot: 8 ): https://www.dropbox.com/s/66bwve8gnn547 ... 008.xml.gz

edit: Save started in HF1 or 2, I think it was HF1.

Update 1 (17.04) : It has been +8 hours since the save point. Stations still unbuilt at the same %'s, so no minerals have been delivered yet.
Update 2 (18.04) : +12 hours since last update. Still no minerals and stations remain unbuilt. Total is now at at least 28+ hours without minerals delivered. I don't think this can be intentional, or at least it shouldn't be.

dyingcrow
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Re: [4.0 HF3 - COH + SV] Xenon not sending materials to build stations

Post by dyingcrow » Mon, 19. Apr 21, 12:24

The state of disrepair the Xenons fall into is even more obvious if you play on their side, either with mod or rep cheat. It comes to a point where all their miners and energy transporters pretty much cease to exist.

Vilmu
Posts: 51
Joined: Tue, 9. Jul 13, 20:45
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Re: [4.0 HF3 - COH + SV] Xenon not sending materials to build stations

Post by Vilmu » Mon, 19. Apr 21, 22:31

I tried to destroy all miners in Matrix #9, including the wharf so they have to build the mining ships in scale plate.
I used some SETA.

Still no minerals delivered. Just 24/7 focusing on the wharf/shipyard only.

I lost my logbook entry for the reputation lost (too many pages' ?). But according to the 'messages' I united Paranid 73 hours a go. So, the buildings have been waiting for materials around 50-65 hours.
Something doesn't seem to be working as intended, I think.

I mean, I shouldn't have to babysit the Xenon to keep them alive or watch them not be able to expand against empty sector...

edit:
this is what they have been trying to "conquer" for 20-30+ hours (don't know exactly because of SETA, but probably more than that. it was already neutral at update 2):
https://i.imgur.com/GRTqHwv.png


Update (20.04):
Increased satellite coverage in scale plate. they do have 30+ miners there, but those are not able to keep up with the demand from 2 wharfs and 2 shipyards or are just choosing to ignore the stations needing materials to be built.

Update (21.04): +13 hours. Still unbuild at same %'s. Xenon is mining out scale plate so badly that it needs to send some of its miners to mine in turquoise sea now, but sadly even these ignore the stations in the same system they're mining in and just deliver the minerals to the shipyards/wharfs (had my hopes up for a minute when I spotted them in TSea)

edit: Newest save (slot 10) with all my updates in it: https://www.dropbox.com/s/m8u4i7f2w57s6 ... 010.xml.gz

edit:
I'm just gonna drop in these 2 quotes from another thread: Potential cause for the issue is ghost build storages with no station attached to them and the Xenon might be wasting resources on them.
arshiba wrote:
Wed, 21. Apr 21, 09:18
I think yesterday I figured out one of the reasons for resource sink (or maybe the main one). And, that is the lost build storages. After analyzing my 72h savegame, I got 123 of 261 total (i.e. 46%) xenon's build storages are lost (no station associated with them). But miners still deliver resources to them instead of wharf/shipyard!
This report gave me this idea. I have observed the behavior of xenon miners (quite strange) in their sectors. Now I made a bug workaround and want to check if my game will get better. Then maybe I'll add it to my mod.
arshiba wrote:
Wed, 21. Apr 21, 21:20
I used your save to check. Removed all lost build storages (all 1055 of 2637, xenon 181 of 208). Skipped 6 game hours. The result is not so impressive, but the xenons are clearly starting to recover.
Perhaps there was also a strong influence of other balancer mods I use, but there are no cheats among them, everything that xenons have had to be built.
Last edited by Terre on Wed, 28. Apr 21, 08:48, edited 1 time in total.
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Vilmu
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Re: [4.0 HF3 - COH + SV] Xenon not sending materials to build stations

Post by Vilmu » Fri, 23. Apr 21, 18:59

Due to other issues/a mistake, I ended up rolling back to the save in the first post. After heavy abuse of SETA (to get roughly where I were before with terraforming), the "world" looks completely different:
https://i.imgur.com/rGHEcy8.png
I did notice that scale plate wharfs / shipyards were not in full production queue 24/7 like they were previously, so it appears to have been a supply/demand issue. And heavy SETA abuse allowed the Xenon ships to live long enough for them to hit job/ship cap and spare the materials for stations. SETA may also have caused the "ghost build storages" to disappear faster, if they were the cause, as I previously kept my SETA usage to minimum.

I'm not 100% sure on it but;
a) Supply/demand issue caused by too few miners and/or mineral density in scale plate when 2 wharfs and 2 shipyards are in full production 24/7.
b) Ghost storage stealing materials.
c) Xenon ships too squishy OOS without SETA, causing high resource demand on their wharfs/shipyards to supply 24/7 construction of ships.
d) Combination of some/all of above.

edit: English.
Last edited by Terre on Wed, 28. Apr 21, 08:48, edited 1 time in total.
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Trueam
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Joined: Sat, 9. Jan 16, 13:19
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Re: [4.0 HF3 - COH + SV] Xenon not sending materials to build stations

Post by Trueam » Tue, 27. Apr 21, 22:08

This can be fixed by assigning ships Xenon S (1 per type wares) as subordinates per station build storage and stations, so they deliver resources faster way.

Xenon S energy distributor running auto trade orders, Miners -Advanced/Expert Auto mine.

Xenon S energy distributor range need to be max MAP range.

I saw this issue long ago, but now it's critical.
:xbtf: :xt: :x2: :x3: :x4: :arrow:

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