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Masterbagger
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Re: Trump

Post by Masterbagger » Thu, 2. Jul 20, 04:46

felter wrote:
Thu, 2. Jul 20, 04:14

Do not talk to me, do not quote me, have nothing to do with me, as I have no interest in anything you have to say,
Medicine is supposed to taste bad. I fulfill your every definition of patriot. You tooted my horn and I came. Ok, phrasing there could be better.
Who made that man a gunner?

pjknibbs
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Re: Trump

Post by pjknibbs » Thu, 2. Jul 20, 08:03

Masterbagger wrote:
Thu, 2. Jul 20, 03:48
Service to country is not your metric. I served and hatred for me is everywhere. Trump is serving now and hatred for him is everywhere. You don't venerate service. You would love him if he was a lefty. Everything is politics now.
No, I'm reasonably certain that any President of any stripe who does the stuff Trump does would be reviled by the left. The real sad thing is that he isn't equally reviled by the right, considering he's an obvious incompetent racist.

BrasatoAlBarolo
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Re: Trump

Post by BrasatoAlBarolo » Thu, 2. Jul 20, 08:54

Masterbagger wrote:
Thu, 2. Jul 20, 03:48
Service to country is not your metric. I served and hatred for me is everywhere. Trump is serving now and hatred for him is everywhere. You don't venerate service. You would love him if he was a lefty. Everything is politics now.
Come on! Trump's strategy against covid is killing tens of thousands people more than the ones who'd die with a proper lockdown. What kind of service is this?
Vertigo 7 wrote:
Thu, 2. Jul 20, 04:22
Vertigo 7 wrote:
Tue, 30. Jun 20, 15:50
Everything used by them to define themselves as a patriot is centered around one thing - me me me me me me me me me I I I I I I I I I I I I
Called it.
GG easy.

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clakclak
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Re: Trump

Post by clakclak » Thu, 2. Jul 20, 09:48

felter wrote:
Tue, 30. Jun 20, 17:32
Vertigo 7 wrote:
Tue, 30. Jun 20, 15:50
But you'll never find these people asking their country to do what's right, even if the outcome doesn't benefit them in any way.
[...]


To me a patriot is a title that is earned through deeds and actions. While also a true patriot would not go around saying that they are a patriot, as that kind of goes against what a true patriot is, as a true patriot is not interested in the title as to them it is their deeds and actions that count. It's their love and devotion to their country, where the country comes before everything else which may even be their own life or the lives and livelihood of their family. It's a title that should be used sparingly, as not many are willing to make that sacrifice. [...]
Honestly that sounds a lot more like a nationalist than a patriot. If you put your country before the people who live in it, even before your own family, than what are you even fighting for? Just a bunch of symbols and words empty of all meaning.

I will never put the flag of any one country above my family, call me a coward or unpatriotic for it, but I think that if you can disregard the live of the people closest to you, than disregarding other human life becomes easy. And when that happens you quickly find yourself fighting for the wrong side. Suddenly you can justify slaughtering innocents in the name of patriotism. Suddenly it becomes easy to see anyone who is not a patriot from your point of view as an enemy. Suddenly that flag you once loved as a symbol of freedom has turned into a symbol of oppression and you are the oppressor.
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Grim Lock
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Re: Trump

Post by Grim Lock » Thu, 2. Jul 20, 11:52

Masterbagger wrote:
Thu, 2. Jul 20, 03:48
I served and hatred for me is everywhere. Trump is serving now and hatred for him is everywhere.
Deservedly so, you blindly support an incompetent dumbass who's doing nothing but throw around playground insults, alienate his international allies to the point where they mock him and your country, plunge the country and thus the world into a longer economic recession due his utter incompetence in handling the corona-virus that btw is killing WAY more Americans than it should but suddenly that doesn't matter, guess life isn't that sacred, you put high praise on symbols that represent the wish for slavery while in support of a man who does one racist thing after another. You're in support of a man whose supporter run around in t-shirts that say "Make Liberals cry again" but when they do you get all offended and uppety. You're getting what you deserve.
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matthewfarmery
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Re: Trump

Post by matthewfarmery » Thu, 2. Jul 20, 12:51

I found this,

How to brief the president

https://edition.cnn.com/videos/politics ... -politics/

So to get his attention, you need to bring pictures, an animated video, before he really becomes interested in what your saying.

I mean, seriously, how dumb can things get? This is the kind of person you simply don't want in the oval office. Someone who has an attention span of a gnat.

Now when it comes to the russian bounties, there still some mixed reports coming from the WH, some are saying that he did read the brief about this, others are saying he did not. even though it was in the brief for that day in question.

I still think he knew about it, but his ties to russia are too strong, he won't come out and openly admit it.

I really hope his tax returns are revealed, I think that will be one step too far for trump, and he will probably resign. I don't see him sticking with the job if people know the truth on where he got all that money from.
=

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fiksal
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Re: Trump

Post by fiksal » Thu, 2. Jul 20, 13:24

Masterbagger wrote:
Thu, 2. Jul 20, 03:48
You would love him if he was a lefty. Everything is politics now.
I can speak for felter.

You have no clue at all or just pretend to not have one.

No one on the left would like if Trump were Democrat, are you serious? Have you seen what Trump's values are, have you seen his actions?

Every politician who acts like Trump needs to be banned from politics permanently. And that's not because of Trump, that's just some common sense.


He is only yours, he has all your values and morals
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Vertigo 7
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Re: Trump

Post by Vertigo 7 » Thu, 2. Jul 20, 13:56

It's hard for a fanatic to admin they were wrong. That goes against the point of being a fanatic - you're always right.
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fiksal
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Re: Trump

Post by fiksal » Thu, 2. Jul 20, 15:05

Vertigo 7 wrote:
Thu, 2. Jul 20, 13:56
It's hard for a fanatic to admin they were wrong. That goes against the point of being a fanatic - you're always right.
In what reality does he think we'd accept the racist views and the actions of a criminal?

Is he trolling or does he really think we are part of his monkey sphere?

clakclak wrote:
Thu, 2. Jul 20, 09:48
felter wrote:
Tue, 30. Jun 20, 17:32
Vertigo 7 wrote:
Tue, 30. Jun 20, 15:50
But you'll never find these people asking their country to do what's right, even if the outcome doesn't benefit them in any way.
[...]
To me a patriot is a title that is earned through deeds and actions. While also a true patriot would not go around saying that they are a patriot, as that kind of goes against what a true patriot is, as a true patriot is not interested in the title as to them it is their deeds and actions that count. It's their love and devotion to their country, where the country comes before everything else which may even be their own life or the lives and livelihood of their family. It's a title that should be used sparingly, as not many are willing to make that sacrifice. [...]
Honestly that sounds a lot more like a nationalist than a patriot. If you put your country before the people who live in it, even before your own family, than what are you even fighting for? Just a bunch of symbols and words empty of all meaning.

I will never put the flag of any one country above my family, call me a coward or unpatriotic for it, but I think that if you can disregard the live of the people closest to you, than disregarding other human life becomes easy. And when that happens you quickly find yourself fighting for the wrong side. Suddenly you can justify slaughtering innocents in the name of patriotism. Suddenly it becomes easy to see anyone who is not a patriot from your point of view as an enemy. Suddenly that flag you once loved as a symbol of freedom has turned into a symbol of oppression and you are the oppressor.
Patriotism deserves a thread on its own. It's a complex one.
I think you are both right in parts.

The definition of the word is very simple and very broad.

What is really true patriotism and where it becomes nationalism? It's hard for me to say personally.

If I were to shape this concept, as felter, I'd say one should prioritize well being of a country, and by country I mean people that live there. This means, at the very least, paying taxes and supporting the development. Supporting social systems and safety net systems. Promoting healthcare and education, working on making it both affordable and accessible, to 100% of population (not 99%, but a 100%). It means not being egotistical.

And as clakclak I'd say this doesnt mean puting a country, a flag or a symbol before its people. No amount of war or violence makes one a patriot.
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BrasatoAlBarolo
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Re: Trump

Post by BrasatoAlBarolo » Thu, 2. Jul 20, 15:21

Honestly, the fact they called "Patriot" a missile tells me a lot about how patriotism is viewed by the average American member of the establishment. It's almost like "being a true patriot" meant bombing anyone who maybe thinks different than you.

Vertigo 7
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Re: Trump

Post by Vertigo 7 » Thu, 2. Jul 20, 15:26

BrasatoAlBarolo wrote:
Thu, 2. Jul 20, 15:21
Honestly, the fact they called "Patriot" a missile tells me a lot about how patriotism is viewed by the average American member of the establishment. It's almost like "being a true patriot" meant bombing anyone who maybe thinks different than you.
To be fair, the patriot missile is an anti air missile designed to shoot down ICBMs and other missiles. Purely defensive.
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Vertigo 7
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Re: Trump

Post by Vertigo 7 » Thu, 2. Jul 20, 16:24

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fNS9mxLMnsU

I take no responsibility. - Donald J. Trump
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matthewfarmery
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Re: Trump

Post by matthewfarmery » Thu, 2. Jul 20, 16:31

Vertigo 7 wrote:
Thu, 2. Jul 20, 16:24
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fNS9mxLMnsU

I take no responsibility. - Donald J. Trump
Sums up Trump nicely, the Lincoln project is doing an awesome job with these adds
=

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clakclak
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Re: Trump

Post by clakclak » Thu, 2. Jul 20, 16:49

matthewfarmery wrote:
Thu, 2. Jul 20, 16:31
Vertigo 7 wrote:
Thu, 2. Jul 20, 16:24
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fNS9mxLMnsU

I take no responsibility. - Donald J. Trump
Sums up Trump nicely, the Lincoln project is doing an awesome job with these adds
I disagree. They once again lack any human component. Only pathos and shibboleth without any real substance, just "Trump is bad". We all know that he is bad, but these ads fail to adress the fallout of his failure as president in any meaningful way.
"The problem with gender is that it prescribes how we should be rather than recognizing how we are. Imagine how much happier we would be, how much freer to be our true individual selves, if we didn't have the weight of gender expectations." - Chimamanda Ngozi Adichie

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mr.WHO
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Re: Trump

Post by mr.WHO » Thu, 2. Jul 20, 17:06

matthewfarmery wrote:
Thu, 2. Jul 20, 16:31
Vertigo 7 wrote:
Thu, 2. Jul 20, 16:24
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fNS9mxLMnsU

I take no responsibility. - Donald J. Trump
Sums up Trump nicely, the Lincoln project is doing an awesome job with these adds
Am I the only one who see the irony of that video, when people who complain the most about Trump will have absolutely no problem with blowing up the Mt. Ruhsmore?

Wasn't statues of 3 out 4 presidents quoted in that video already destroyed in last month BLM?

BrasatoAlBarolo
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Re: Trump

Post by BrasatoAlBarolo » Thu, 2. Jul 20, 17:09

clakclak wrote:
Thu, 2. Jul 20, 16:49
matthewfarmery wrote:
Thu, 2. Jul 20, 16:31
Vertigo 7 wrote:
Thu, 2. Jul 20, 16:24
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fNS9mxLMnsU

I take no responsibility. - Donald J. Trump
Sums up Trump nicely, the Lincoln project is doing an awesome job with these adds
I disagree. They once again lack any human component. Only pathos and shibboleth without any real substance, just "Trump is bad". We all know that he is bad, but these ads fail to adress the fallout of his failure as president in any meaningful way.
I think it's a deliberate strategy. If you say "he's bad", he's the one who needs to tell why he's not. And that's really hard, because he'd need to explain his choices. Instead, if you say "he did this, so he's bad" it's very easy for a manipulative liar with a huge staff of manipulators cherry picking the case when he's been "good".
In politics, the majority of people you're talking to have the mind / attention span of children, because they don't have time, don't want or just can't understand properly what' you're talking about. Now, as you see, political choices of voters look very much like supporting a sport team. Lakers or Celtics? Dolphins or Giants? Juve or Inter? Biden or Trump? It all looks the same. Even if I'm not really sure Dolphins play the same sport of Giants, or Biden plays the same sport of Trump.

(edited because of spelling mistakes)
Last edited by BrasatoAlBarolo on Thu, 2. Jul 20, 17:14, edited 1 time in total.

Vertigo 7
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Re: Trump

Post by Vertigo 7 » Thu, 2. Jul 20, 17:11

mr.WHO wrote:
Thu, 2. Jul 20, 17:06
matthewfarmery wrote:
Thu, 2. Jul 20, 16:31
Vertigo 7 wrote:
Thu, 2. Jul 20, 16:24
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fNS9mxLMnsU

I take no responsibility. - Donald J. Trump
Sums up Trump nicely, the Lincoln project is doing an awesome job with these adds
Am I the only one who see the irony of that video, when people who complain the most about Trump will have absolutely no problem with blowing up the Mt. Ruhsmore?

Wasn't statues of 3 out 4 presidents quoted in that video already destroyed in last month BLM?
That has nothing to do with the Lincoln Project or the ad. Trump is making a big deal about celebrating the 4th at Mount Rushmore and this ad is running on his base's favorite TV stations.
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fiksal
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Re: Trump

Post by fiksal » Thu, 2. Jul 20, 18:35

mr.WHO wrote:
Thu, 2. Jul 20, 17:06
Am I the only one who see the irony of that video, when people who complain the most about Trump will have absolutely no problem with blowing up the Mt. Ruhsmore?

Wasn't statues of 3 out 4 presidents quoted in that video already destroyed in last month BLM?
It's not for them. This is made by the group of Republicans. Their message is for Republicans who like the statues and words like "great" "honor" "presidents".
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mr.WHO
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Re: Trump

Post by mr.WHO » Thu, 2. Jul 20, 18:43

fiksal wrote:
Thu, 2. Jul 20, 18:35
mr.WHO wrote:
Thu, 2. Jul 20, 17:06
Am I the only one who see the irony of that video, when people who complain the most about Trump will have absolutely no problem with blowing up the Mt. Ruhsmore?

Wasn't statues of 3 out 4 presidents quoted in that video already destroyed in last month BLM?
It's not for them. This is made by the group of Republicans. Their message is for Republicans who like the statues and words like "great" "honor" "presidents".
It doesn't matter - with last events, this ads looks rudiculous even it it wasn't the original intention.
It reminds me that ad with black child wearing the sweater "coolest monkey in the jungle" - it was innocent children clothes ad, yet it was put in bad time.

Vertigo 7
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Re: Trump

Post by Vertigo 7 » Thu, 2. Jul 20, 20:58

mr.WHO wrote:
Thu, 2. Jul 20, 18:43
fiksal wrote:
Thu, 2. Jul 20, 18:35
mr.WHO wrote:
Thu, 2. Jul 20, 17:06
Am I the only one who see the irony of that video, when people who complain the most about Trump will have absolutely no problem with blowing up the Mt. Ruhsmore?

Wasn't statues of 3 out 4 presidents quoted in that video already destroyed in last month BLM?
It's not for them. This is made by the group of Republicans. Their message is for Republicans who like the statues and words like "great" "honor" "presidents".
It doesn't matter - with last events, this ads looks rudiculous even it it wasn't the original intention.
It reminds me that ad with black child wearing the sweater "coolest monkey in the jungle" - it was innocent children clothes ad, yet it was put in bad time.
Sorry, but that would be a horrible ad at any time. I really don't understand how you're able to draw a parallel between the two. When is it a good time to suggest a black child is a monkey?
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Fight white supremacy, fight corporate influence, fight for the rights of all peoples!

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