Trump

[Masterbagger]

Erm, fairly sure the socialism line has been trotted out for donkeys years, it's not a Trump led statement.

Perhaps not, but the GOP generally are doubling down on it as a criticism of the Dems (when seemingly neither actually understand what it means).

Find a better word for what democrats are doing and I'll consider using it. I just call it as I see it. Their plans are bad and I don't want to try them.

[RegisterMe]

Erm, fairly sure the socialism line has been trotted out for donkeys years, it's not a Trump led statement.

Perhaps not, but the GOP generally are doubling down on it as a criticism of the Dems (when seemingly neither actually understand what it means).

Find a better word for what democrats are doing and I'll consider using it. I just call it as I see it. Their plans are bad and I don't want to try them.

What are the Democrats doing?

[Vertigo 7]

Erm, fairly sure the socialism line has been trotted out for donkeys years, it's not a Trump led statement.

Perhaps not, but the GOP generally are doubling down on it as a criticism of the Dems (when seemingly neither actually understand what it means).

Find a better word for what democrats are doing and I'll consider using it. I just call it as I see it. Their plans are bad and I don't want to try them.

Responsible, compassionate, helpful, useful, caring, democratic, intelligent, thoughtful, inclusive, American

there's 10 words. Take your pick.

[Grim Lock]

Perhaps not, but the GOP generally are doubling down on it as a criticism of the Dems (when seemingly neither actually understand what it means).

Find a better word for what democrats are doing and I'll consider using it. I just call it as I see it. Their plans are bad and I don't want to try them.

What are the Democrats doing?

Unlike Trump, currently nothing to destroy the once respected status internationally the US sometimes had.

Again the Trumpians didn't elect Trump because he's good for the country, he's elected because he's bad for democrats. SAD

Also a war with Iran seems to be more and more in the cards... sigh

[Bishop149]

Unlike Trump, currently nothing to destroy the once respected status internationally the US sometimes had.

I dunno about that.
They are singularly failing to even ATTEMPT to hold Trump to account, to such a degree that they are arguable now complicit.

[Grim Lock]

Unlike Trump, currently nothing to destroy the once respected status internationally the US sometimes had.

I dunno about that.
They are singularly failing to even ATTEMPT to hold Trump to account, to such a degree that they are arguable now complicit.

Oooooh i do like that viewpoint, doesn't exactly help the little respect i've got left for the USA as a country but still.

[BugMeister]

wow, dude - that's a bit harsh..

- c'mon USA..!!

[Vertigo 7]

Unlike Trump, currently nothing to destroy the once respected status internationally the US sometimes had.

I dunno about that.
They are singularly failing to even ATTEMPT to hold Trump to account, to such a degree that they are arguable now complicit.

You must be joking. Have you not seen the number of times he's been sued every time he does something stupid?

[Grim Lock]

Any of those succesfull? Or having a positive effect?

that's a serious question, not trying to be cynical.


Edit: It's just that it hardly matters where i look, democrats and republicans, both seem to be mostly people that should be in homes for the elderly beeing taken care of, instead of them attempting to take care of an entire country. Sure i consider the republicans the worst offender concerning that, the democrats are only marginally doing better.

I've said it many times in this thread, but one of the things republicans and democrats should be demanding together is term-limits on many many more position in government, you seriously need to get rid of most of the political dinosaurs that have been bought and paid for ages ago.

[Vertigo 7]

Any of those succesfull? Or having a positive effect?

that's a serious question, not trying to be cynical.

yes and no. neither sides typically accepts a legal loss so the law suits make their way to the supreme court, most of the time. SCOTUS has taken the position that they are not going to rule in cases where the outcome would create legislation, as that's the responsibility of congress - I tend to agree with them on that. But then congress can accomplish little due to the senate going into a perpetual filibuster so new legislation goes no where. It's a freaking circus.

On the other hand, where Trump has been in clear violation of the constitution, SCOTUS has shut him down.

[Grim Lock]

Now i am beeing cynical: So basicly, apart from muddying the tracks that Trump want to follow, nothing really stands out.

And that's related to what annoys me a lot about the US political system, years and years we've been hearing about checks and balances and how important they are for democracy etc. and have seen the US tell other countries how they should do democracy and how to have just Society. Now they've got a pathological liar in office who also might have serious condition deteriorating his mental capacity, insulting allies and praising dictators, and there's just seemingly no way to hold him accountable.It's all just so dissapointing.

[Vertigo 7]

Now i am beeing cynical: So basicly, apart from muddying the tracks that Trump want to follow, nothing really stands out.

And that's related to what annoys me a lot about the US political system, years and years we've been hearing about checks and balances and how important they are for democracy etc. and have seen the US tell other countries how they should do democracy and how to have just Society. Now they've got a pathological liar in office who also might have serious condition deteriorating his mental capacity, insulting allies and praising dictators, and there's just seemingly no way to hold him accountable.It's all just so dissapointing.

well, to be fair, it's not the democratic system that's broken, it's a few specific things in our implementation that has created a mess. The filibuster, and lobbying, I think are the two biggest problems in the US government.

Corporations should not be able to write a check to influence legislation. After all, the government is accountable to the people, not to Walmart.

And this filibustering nonsense meant to stall legislation with pointless "debate"? Seriously, wtf... why is a senator allowed to stand up and read Dr. Seuss to delay a vote? I mean hey, if you have a legitimate gripe about proposed legislation, air your grievances. Otherwise, sit down, stfu, and vote.

It really comes down to irresponsible political leaders that would rather act like children than to serve the people.

[felter]

@Masterbagger, you do realise there is a good chance that one of those so called Democrats are going to be your next President. Think on it like this, at least if that happens you will know how that 60% feel about Trump.

[Bishop149]

I dunno about that.
They are singularly failing to even ATTEMPT to hold Trump to account, to such a degree that they are arguable now complicit.

You must be joking. Have you not seen the number of times he's been sued every time he does something stupid?
[/quote]

Lower down the Democrat hierarchy there are some individuals doing some sterling work, various State AGs have done very well legally roadblocking Trump's nonsense . . . at least at the level of their specific state.
I was mostly referring to the Dems. in congress, whose attitude would appear to be: "We'll just lose in the Senate anyway so we'll just sit it out . . .its only 4 years after all!!"
An attitude I have zero truck with, firstly because the way they are carrying on all but ensures its gonna 8 years and the longer they let it go unchallenged at the federal / congressional the more of the precedent is set.

[Vertigo 7]

Lower down the Democrat hierarchy there are some individuals doing some sterling work, various State AGs have done very well legally roadblocking Trump's nonsense . . . at least at the level of their specific state.
I was mostly referring to the Dems. in congress, whose attitude would appear to be: "We'll just lose in the Senate anyway so we'll just sit it out . . .its only 4 years after all!!"
An attitude I have zero truck with, firstly because the way they are carrying on all but ensures its gonna 8 years and the longer they let it go unchallenged at the federal / congressional the more of the precedent is set.

That's not really fair. Mitch has flat out said he's going to filibuster anything the democrats pass through the house. The GOP has shown no to very little willingness to draft bipartisan legislation, and Trump vetos any legislation that doesn't give him what he wants, which is why the government shutdown happened last December when congress didn't give him money for that dumb wall.

The house is doing everything it can. Without a significant number of defections in the senate, most legislation dies there, and the rest, most likely, dies with Trump. At present, there is little that can be done.

[Grim Lock]

That's not really fair. Mitch has flat out said he's going to filibuster anything the democrats pass through the house. The GOP has shown no to very little willingness to draft bipartisan legislation, and Trump vetos any legislation that doesn't give him what he wants, which is why the government shutdown happened last December when congress didn't give him money for that dumb wall.

The house is doing everything it can. Without a significant number of defections in the senate, most legislation dies there, and the rest, most likely, dies with Trump. At present, there is little that can be done.

And that is why i am maintaining that US politics is broken to the core, if a president can get away with that many blatant lies just because it's dependant on how much power the party that opposes him by default anyway has or has not, that country doesn't actually have any unbiased checks and balances in place. Justice in the US is not blind when it should be.

[Vertigo 7]

It's never quite that simple.

By and large, the US government has done quite a lot of good for the country, until recently. The problem is, when the world became connected through the interwebs, the government did not move to keep pace with this new world. Now we have open platforms where any politician can spin their own version of events without debate, other entities can say whatever they want to influence public opinion, foreign powers are able to reach American voters to push their agendas. It's become such a dizzying onslaught of BS, the truth gets lost among the noise.

The result is you have more and more people that give up thinking for themselves and blindly accept political opinion or agenda as factual information. That is where we've lost several steps. Critical thinking needs to take a higher priority.

We want to believe our political leaders have our best interests in mind. But they need to earn that trust instead of it being blindly granted, and then call them on it if they abuse that trust.

[Grim Lock]

It's never quite that simple.

By and large, the US government has done quite a lot of good for the country, until recently. The problem is, when the world became connected through the interwebs, the government did not move to keep pace with this new world. Now we have open platforms where any politician can spin their own version of events without debate, other entities can say whatever they want to influence public opinion, foreign powers are able to reach American voters to push their agendas. It's become such a dizzying onslaught of BS, the truth gets lost among the noise.

The result is you have more and more people that give up thinking for themselves and blindly accept political opinion or agenda as factual information. That is where we've lost several steps. Critical thinking needs to take a higher priority.

We want to believe our political leaders have our best interests in mind. But they need to earn that trust instead of it being blindly granted, and then call them on it if they abuse that trust.

I'm sorry, still nothing there to convince me the US doesn't have an serious fundamental problem baked right into the political process. You just don't seem to aply your justice system equally it totally depends on who is in power and where.

[Vertigo 7]

It's never quite that simple.

By and large, the US government has done quite a lot of good for the country, until recently. The problem is, when the world became connected through the interwebs, the government did not move to keep pace with this new world. Now we have open platforms where any politician can spin their own version of events without debate, other entities can say whatever they want to influence public opinion, foreign powers are able to reach American voters to push their agendas. It's become such a dizzying onslaught of BS, the truth gets lost among the noise.

The result is you have more and more people that give up thinking for themselves and blindly accept political opinion or agenda as factual information. That is where we've lost several steps. Critical thinking needs to take a higher priority.

We want to believe our political leaders have our best interests in mind. But they need to earn that trust instead of it being blindly granted, and then call them on it if they abuse that trust.

I'm sorry, still nothing there to convince me the US doesn't have an serious fundamental problem baked right into the political process. You just don't seem to aply your justice system equally it totally depends on who is in power and where.

Generally speaking, most of the elected officials are more moderate than what you're seeing today. I wouldn't even call Trump "extreme right". I would call him a self absorbed imbecilic racist that's forced hard divisions between the left and right.

I said it a while back, we're in a unique situation with this current administration. He has made the republican party leaders swear oaths of fealty to him that has made his parties priority to Trump, party, country - in that order. And with the current stack of officials, the best way to fight back is to stalemate the administration as much as possible.

[Grim Lock]

Yeah and then once a democrat gets into power, the republicans will stalemate them as much as possible and after that vice versa again. I am maintaining my it's broken to the core opinion. So sorry