[X3LU] Mayhem 3.21b

[Hairless-Ape]

They return to any sanctuary which can repair them, get their HP back and rejoin the fleet. I think they would slowboat, but they try to refuel before leaving. You could also use Mayhem's new ferries to fetch incoming ships.

What about the refueling question? Thoughts?


Also, Joubarbe, I hear ya about code documentation. I was a dam good programmer for 25 years and just retired a couple years ago and it was always one of my pet peeves. 90% of the devs around me basically had the opinion that all code was self-documenting, when it truth, they were just lazy f'cks. Time and time again, they would see other dev's code (or their own code a year later) and ask "hmm why did they do it this way?".. they could read code just fine like we all can, but there's always some intent in doing it a certain way that isn't obvious. So instead of stupid sh*t comments like "set x = 5", it's great to have comments that say "iterate this 5 times, or you won't get enough accuracy to hit the target".
Anyway, I'm not expecting you to comment your code at all.. but do realize that the encyclopedia is very high level and really doesn't explain the details of how things behave, which is critical imo to managing things. For example, I don't think you'll find any answers there regarding how the call to arms command will behave in regards to what ships will do when they try to refuel. You know the answer, and others figure it out by watching I guess, but I think a decent guide would be a truly great addition to Mayhem. Nothing to tell you how to play, but something to describe stuff, so schmuck dip's like me don't have to search through 10k posts, or repeatedly post questions to the point where people get sick of seeing them post..
Ok, rant over. I'm going back to taking over all the xenon sectors. I think beer is in order too.

[Joubarbe]

It's not a refuel, it's a resupply. If ship A has 5 Chaff and needs only 3, ship B that needs 2 and has 0 will take them from ship A.

[Tomsoneeta]

The Xenon/Pirate change is glorious Thank you!

[Hairless-Ape]

It's not a refuel, it's a resupply. If ship A has 5 Chaff and needs only 3, ship B that needs 2 and has 0 will take them from ship A.

Experiment:

Took a fleet of 10 M6's, each with fuel supply set to 100. All fully fueled except fleet leader, who was empty on fuel.
Call to arms - Nothing happened. No one moved, no one refueled.
Added a full energy hauler to the fleet (Nexus). Moved it next to fleet.
Call to arms - Nothing happened. No one moved or refueled.
Dumped 100 energy from one of the M6's.
Call to arms - that one M6 moved to a nearby sanctuary, refueled and came back. Leader still empty. energy hauler still full.
Added Transporter device and Supply command software to the energy hauler. Repeated steps. Nothing happened.
Dumped more fuel from one of the M6's and repeated. He still went to a sanctuary rather than refuel from the energy hauler.

So you can see.. I'm missing something here. It's never as simple as it seems for plebes like me. Help?

[djmidex]

It's not a refuel, it's a resupply. If ship A has 5 Chaff and needs only 3, ship B that needs 2 and has 0 will take them from ship A.

Experiment:

Took a fleet of 10 M6's, each with fuel supply set to 100. All fully fueled except fleet leader, who was empty on fuel.
Call to arms - Nothing happened. No one moved, no one refueled.
Added a full energy hauler to the fleet (Nexus). Moved it next to fleet.
Call to arms - Nothing happened. No one moved or refueled.
Dumped 100 energy from one of the M6's.
Call to arms - that one M6 moved to a nearby sanctuary, refueled and came back. Leader still empty. energy hauler still full.
Added Transporter device and Supply command software to the energy hauler. Repeated steps. Nothing happened.
Dumped more fuel from one of the M6's and repeated. He still went to a sanctuary rather than refuel from the energy hauler.

So you can see.. I'm missing something here. It's never as simple as it seems for plebes like me. Help?

I made the same experiment recently. Same story

[Joubarbe]

Leaders are not resupplied.
Needs Transporter Device on either the M6 or the TS.

[gastovski]

hello, is this compatible with A New Dawn mod?.

[Joubarbe]

hello, is this compatible with A New Dawn mod?.

Very unlikely.

[aurelcourt]

It's not a refuel, it's a resupply. If ship A has 5 Chaff and needs only 3, ship B that needs 2 and has 0 will take them from ship A.

Experiment:

.............

So you can see.. I'm missing something here. It's never as simple as it seems for plebes like me. Help?

- Leader is not resupplied : easy way is to set up a courier that resupplies him
- when Call to Arms, all nearby ships will resupply their fuel and missiles from whatever ship in the fleet which had a transporter device AND which has supplies above their own resupp threshold

- easy set up is to have a leader with big cargo, and set up a courier which maintains the desired amount of fuel and missiles in the leader. At each CTA, all fleet ships will then resupp from leader.

- if fleet scattered a bit, CTA first time to bring fleet together. CTA second time to resupply all fleet.

- other option : a resupp TS with a TD. Make sure to have the TS resupplied with courier or take him from time to time to refuel at his base (manually). Don't give him a high refuel jump threshold otherwise it won't give fuel to other ships as soon as his fuel drops below set amount.


Hope this helps.


EDIT : in your experiment, probably your refuel Nexus has a very high jump refuel threshold (like 600 maybe) and not MORE fuel than that so it can't give them to other ships as that would drop it below his minimum threshold.
Make it 100 jumps for him too so it keeps 1000 ecells for him, and fill it with ecells entirely. Anything above 1000 will be use to resupply the fleet

[Joubarbe]

The resupply drone can also be helpful.

[Hairless-Ape]

- Leader is not resupplied : easy way is to set up a courier that resupplies him
- when Call to Arms, all nearby ships will resupply their fuel and missiles from whatever ship in the fleet which had a transporter device AND which has supplies above their own resupp threshold
- easy set up is to have a leader with big cargo, and set up a courier which maintains the desired amount of fuel and missiles in the leader. At each CTA, all fleet ships will then resupp from leader.
- if fleet scattered a bit, CTA first time to bring fleet together. CTA second time to resupply all fleet.
- other option : a resupp TS with a TD. Make sure to have the TS resupplied with courier or take him from time to time to refuel at his base (manually). Don't give him a high refuel jump threshold otherwise it won't give fuel to other ships as soon as his fuel drops below set amount.
EDIT : in your experiment, probably your refuel Nexus has a very high jump refuel threshold (like 600 maybe) and not MORE fuel than that so it can't give them to other ships as that would drop it below his minimum threshold.
Make it 100 jumps for him too so it keeps 1000 ecells for him, and fill it with ecells entirely. Anything above 1000 will be use to resupply the fleet

Awesome information.

As I suspected, it's never as simple as the encyclopedia says.. THIS is why Mayhem needs a basic feature guide or a lot of work on it's encyclopedia. Not something to tell you how to play, but something that explains the basic mechanics of the Mayhem specific features.

In my case, 3 critical pieces of missing information not found anywhere else were really required to get this working. I guessed right on 1 (TD), but would have never guessed at the others.

Thank you for the actual answer aurelcourt.


The Truth is out there - Mulder.

[aurelcourt]

You're welcome!

Took me a while and many questions here as well to figure it all out.

Other thing : fighters will dock at appropriate ship to resupply if no ship with TD in the fleet.

I don't use missiles (yet) in my current playthrough but that info can be of importance if you think about some complex resupply setups for fuel + missiles....

But definitely you want at least one ship with big cargo and a TD in the fleet. Makes things way more easier and allows various setups.

---------------

Happy to help for a quick guide if anyone has a list of questions / topic index.

I agree the mod is so deep now it lacks a bit of available sources of information. YouTube tutorials are excellent to illustrate but not fully sufficient to understand all the complex commands and possibilities

[Hairless-Ape]

Why does the Call to Arms feature set all turrets to "Defense" mode?

I have some capital ship leaders along with support fighters in each fleet, and of course, they get scattered.. so I Call to Arms, and the next thing I know, my capital ship leader is longer are shooting much of anything.. I have to manually go set their turrets back to Attack all Enemies. At present, I'm using Raven's heavily and they are ALL turrets, no main guns.. so they really stop being effective when this happens. Just curious why this was specifically set this way.

Thanks.

[Joubarbe]

Because in theory, you don't use Call To Arms to attack. Turrets are automatically set to attack when you use other fleet commands, such as Attack All Enemies. But, yeah, it's probably an oversight. I'll have to think about it.

[Hairless-Ape]

Mostly, it's causing issues when trying to invade a sector.
The enemy sends rather large waves in, and the best workable solution to engage them efficiently, without all your ships stepping on each other, is to broadcast to everyone in the sector to Attack All enemies (This was also a tip from Darth Fiscus vid). I found that to be utterly true. So after one wave is wiped, you try to tell your fleets to "Invade the sector" again so they will start hitting stations, but find they are all separated now and you have to call "Call to arms" again to get them all to respond to the fleet invasion command properly. At that point, anything with turrets (such as my primary M7's) become fairly useless.. I was sitting in one wondering why it wasn't shooting the station on it's own anymore and found I had to command the turrets to attack all enemies again. It's not a show-stopper, but also if there's no practical reason to mess with the turrets then maybe we can take that line out of there.

Also found the extremely large sectors don't get their asteroids scanned. Scanner ships just ignore them and move on like there are no asteroids at all.. Maybe check $ClosestDistanceSoFar set in Cmd.ScanAsteroids.xml ?


cheers

[Joubarbe]

I've thought about it:

CHANGE: Mayhem will not override turret commands. That is especially true for fleets: if you manually set turrets, they won't be changed. If turrets have no commands, Mayhem will set them to defense or attack, depending on the situation.

[radulpik]

First, thank you for this fantastic mod. Truly fantastic! I've lost many nights of sleep to this adventure.

However - I'm having a problem with the victory rewards. The message says that reputation with all major factions is maxed, all ship data is awarded and a 100M credits are received. I only received the 100M - no change to my reputations or ship data!? I could swear this worked last time I played the 2.7ish version. When I then buy shipyard information after the victory messages it says that I already have all the ship data available.

Only thing I did differently this time was that I rescued the BH sanctuary prior to discovering any OCV stations at all. Any ideas?

[Joubarbe]

Ship data is the thing you need to research. Not ship blueprints. Are you sure you don't have them? Maxing out reputation has been removed, did you see that you were supposed to receive that somewhere?

"rescued the BH sanctuary", please elaborate. What is that? (/spoiler if needed)

[radulpik]

Ship data is the thing you need to research. Not ship blueprints. Are you sure you don't have them? Maxing out reputation has been removed, did you see that you were supposed to receive that somewhere?

"rescued the BH sanctuary", please elaborate. What is that? (/spoiler if needed)

Th final victory message reads:
Message from: Mayhem
You've just won the game!
You can now continue playing with your empire. You have received 100 million credits, full reputation with all major factions and all ship data. Congratulations!

I definitely don't have any additional blueprints to research. I still only have 8 M2 blueprints to research, of which I have researched 3. BH is just Blue Horizon, not important.

And taking away the full rep makes more sense - it prevents rushing when I can't sustain holding off the Terrans long term. I''m playing on a clean install with 2.9.9.

[Joubarbe]

Yeah, I forgot this message.
I'll fix the ship data stuff.

Blue Horizon is important, especially if you're able to go there before completing the OCV station part of the main story... So... Tell me everything now! The exploitation of pandas is illegal!