[X3LU] Mayhem 3.21b

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Kadatherion
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Re: [X3LU] Mayhem 2.7.7

Post by Kadatherion » Fri, 2. Nov 18, 14:13

CHANGE: All OTAS ships are now properly classified as Argon ships, meaning that you can buy their data from the Argon market (and that Argon Battle Groups will use them)
There goes the (cheaty) uniqueness of my fleet composition :cry:

Oh, well, that's going to be a reason to erase the Argon from the galaxy then. Thanks for the update, mate :wink:

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Joubarbe
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Re: [X3LU] Mayhem 2.7.7

Post by Joubarbe » Fri, 2. Nov 18, 20:50

"Oh look, a sector where 3 hostile Battle Fleets are crossing to go invade other territories, let's try to go past them and ****** waste 20 minutes of unsaved game!"

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Shuulo
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Re: [X3LU] Mayhem 2.7.7

Post by Shuulo » Fri, 2. Nov 18, 22:19

Just to clarify, turning off battlegroup jumping will lead to basically jump-less wars? do defenders still jump in?

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Joubarbe
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Re: [X3LU] Mayhem 2.7.7

Post by Joubarbe » Fri, 2. Nov 18, 22:24

Defenders on clean wars come as soon as the invasion is launched. Meaning that without instant jumps, both attackers and defenders will start their journey towards the targeted sector at the same time, without a single jump. I've seen some interesting stuff so far...

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Shuulo
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Re: [X3LU] Mayhem 2.7.7

Post by Shuulo » Fri, 2. Nov 18, 22:48

As far as i know its possible for a shipyard to launch an invasion across the galaxy, is it still the case? Or shipyard prioritize sectors that are closer to them?
Also, do defenders in dirty wars work differently?

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Joubarbe
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Re: [X3LU] Mayhem 2.7.7

Post by Joubarbe » Sat, 3. Nov 18, 03:17

Hmm... There's a bug with my code, they're supposed to prioritize nearest sectors, but they don't. I'll fix that.

In dirty wars, Defenders come when a station is destroyed. (in that regard, there's a difference between real dirty wars, and dirty wars that you can activate through the t-file)
Last edited by Joubarbe on Sat, 3. Nov 18, 10:59, edited 1 time in total.


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Shuulo
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Re: [X3LU] Mayhem 2.7.8

Post by Shuulo » Sat, 3. Nov 18, 20:40

Now that kind of game looks interesting. Do you suggest it to pair with no-jumpdrive game?
Do you have more stories that happened with that setup?

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Joubarbe
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Re: [X3LU] Mayhem 2.7.8

Post by Joubarbe » Sat, 3. Nov 18, 21:07

I'm currently playing with no distant jumps and no jumpdrive, and yeah, it's fun, to me. Slow game, chaotic. But that's too experimental to make it "official". In my current game, Yakis are everywhere!

amadeok
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Re: [X3LU] Mayhem 2.7.8

Post by amadeok » Sat, 3. Nov 18, 21:39

Hi,
I think i have to report a bug. The game freezes when i use the Supply refuel command. I had the same problem before with vanilla litcube, and the changelog stated that it was fixed.
This savegame i uploaded does not freeze, because i didn't give command to the Supply ship. There is only one ship that has the supply command software and it's UT 004 Caiman Adv
https://drive.google.com/file/d/11K41_r ... sp=sharing
Btw its a great mod, i hope that x4 is like this.

amadeok
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Re: [X3LU] Mayhem 2.7.8

Post by amadeok » Tue, 6. Nov 18, 03:49

Hi,
After playing for a while the framerate goes from around 50 to around 20. If i reload the savegame it goes back to 50, but after a while it goes back again to 20. Anyone had this problem?
This the save: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1lInwxx ... sp=sharing
I'm using only MLCC TM Compatibility and ADS - Joubarbian Edition, that i extracted into the main installation folder. Is this correct or should extract them to the addon folder?
Anyone please?
Is there any way i can see what scripts are running in real time to try to troubleshoot it?

Fureimuu
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Re: [X3LU] Mayhem 2.7.8

Post by Fureimuu » Tue, 6. Nov 18, 12:09

Does it happen everywhere or in a certain sector(s)?

lighters
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Re: [X3LU] Mayhem 2.7.8

Post by lighters » Tue, 6. Nov 18, 12:35

Does Mayhem change turn rate of the ships? In LU average turn rate of M2s is 0.3-0.4 rpm which is already very low, but now in Mayhem I see 0.2 and even 0.1 sometimes which just doesn't make any sense - they can cross an entire sector for the same time they can turn around on the spot. It also messes up the AI which uses full forward when attacking and thus sends the ship into a 50 km loop to just turn around.

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Shuulo
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Re: [X3LU] Mayhem 2.7.8

Post by Shuulo » Tue, 6. Nov 18, 21:57

lighters wrote:
Tue, 6. Nov 18, 12:35
Does Mayhem change turn rate of the ships? In LU average turn rate of M2s is 0.3-0.4 rpm which is already very low, but now in Mayhem I see 0.2 and even 0.1 sometimes which just doesn't make any sense - they can cross an entire sector for the same time they can turn around on the spot. It also messes up the AI which uses full forward when attacking and thus sends the ship into a 50 km loop to just turn around.
Yes, mayhem has some changes to ship parameters. Also, if i remember correctly Mayhem changes the way capital ships engage, so they do not go full forward but try to circle the enemy shooting with their side turrets (if they do not have main weapons)

Kadatherion
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Re: [X3LU] Mayhem 2.7.8

Post by Kadatherion » Wed, 7. Nov 18, 13:13

lighters wrote:
Tue, 6. Nov 18, 12:35
Does Mayhem change turn rate of the ships? In LU average turn rate of M2s is 0.3-0.4 rpm which is already very low, but now in Mayhem I see 0.2 and even 0.1 sometimes which just doesn't make any sense - they can cross an entire sector for the same time they can turn around on the spot. It also messes up the AI which uses full forward when attacking and thus sends the ship into a 50 km loop to just turn around.
Actually, not really: yaw, pitch and roll RPM is pretty much the same for M2s in Mayhem and Litcube (just quickly checked comparing the two tships files). Even in Litcube's a 0.3 RPM turn rate is a HIGH turn rate given only to light and "nimble" M2s like the OTAS Boreas. Normal M2s usually are around 0.2 (like the Titan or Atlas, to remain in Argon territory), while M2P (like the Excalibur) usually are 0.1. There might end up being a slight difference in the actual game, when compared to LU, because in Mayhem you don't have speed/turn extensions to buy (except for just 1 speed extension through perks), but it doesn't make much of a difference tbh.

And, btw, that's pretty much a necessity given the weapon rebalance done by Litcube: the decreased fire rate mixed with the much shorter fire sustainability of every weapon NEEDS less agile big ships, capital ship weapons can be as slow as firing 2 salvos per minute, more agile M2s could make cap ship battles close to impossible to resolve IS.

Kadatherion
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Re: [X3LU] Mayhem 2.7.8

Post by Kadatherion » Wed, 7. Nov 18, 15:43

While I'm here, double post - pardon me - since it's a whole other topic: Joubarbe, while playing and messing a bit with my files to rebalance a couple things to my tastes, I noticed an issue with the Cluster Flaks. I believe it probably was already in LU, but since Mayhem also comes with its own graphics package now, you might be interested in looking into it.

Basically, I found that a good chunk of Cluster Flaks firing together (as it often happens if you fly an Argon M2, as they are among the best weapons for defense against fighters and even medium sized threats) easily halve my FPS, from stable 60s to low 30s. This doesn't come from the actual "fragments" but from the lens flare effect: I just switched it in the effects.txt to the similar (but white) lens flare effect of the terran equivalent artillery (thus, using the lens flare from effect 304 in the effect 310, IIRC), and I'm good to go again. Teladi normal flak artillery works fine as well, not even the slightest FPS drop.

I have a quite decent GTX 1060 6GB, so it really shouldn't be a GPU bottleneck. Initially I guessed it had to be a CPU bottleneck for the hit detection of cluster flaks, but if just changing the lens flare effect solves it, maybe the effect itself is badly optimized? Mine was just a quick and dirty edit to make the game better playable, but for visual variety's sake I suppose a good approach could be copying the actual lens flare graphics of either the normal flak or the starbust shockwave cannon, and change its color back to the reddish one the Cluster Flaks normally have. Still not going to be exactly the same as it was, but better than nothing I guess.

Fureimuu
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Re: [X3LU] Mayhem 2.7.8

Post by Fureimuu » Wed, 7. Nov 18, 17:57

This game doesn't know what gpu bottleneck is. The engine is too old to properly utilize your videocard.

Kadatherion
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Re: [X3LU] Mayhem 2.7.8

Post by Kadatherion » Wed, 7. Nov 18, 18:43

Fureimuu wrote:
Wed, 7. Nov 18, 17:57
This game doesn't know what gpu bottleneck is. The engine is too old to properly utilize your videocard.
That's a different matter. The greatest perfomance issue and as such bottleneck with the game - because of its old engine - is CPU, as it's a single threaded application (with LOTS of CPU calculations going on with thousands of ships, entities and scripts running). That's why Litcube rebalanced the weapons so that there are much fewer projectiles in space at any one time: because each projectile calls for CPU calculations (especially on hit): the actual video load of more projectiles has always been in comparison fairly negligible in X3.
When it comes to two lens flare effects that should pretty much be the same kind of asset except for color and a slight linear glow, and one of the two halves your FPS while the other causes no loss whatsoever, then the issue does not come from the engine being old per se (which it is, often overloading the CPU when GPU could indeed be used more and better), it likely is the specific asset.

Ragemaster9999
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Re: [X3LU] Mayhem 2.7.8

Post by Ragemaster9999 » Thu, 8. Nov 18, 04:04

I cant figure out how to get a transporter or salvage insurance. I need a transporter device to arm my orbital weapons platform before the first wave arrives, can anyone give me some advice.

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