Wasps. With a period.

Corporeal · Post by **Corporeal** » Sat, 5. Jun 10, 04:49

What has a range of 18 Km, moves like a PAC, seeks, fires in a swarm, takes only 1 S-class unit, takes less than a second to reload, has a factory that builds 150/hour, and still manages to do 8K damage?

The biggest bang-for-your Buck in X3TC:
Wasps. With a period.

Wasps may not pack much punch they have everything else. Bringing up the scale of their numbers and damage is the key to this ultimate weapon.

we all start small though. After dropping a fighter's shields 2-3 Wasps is a small expense for the saved gun energy. Especially in a furball.

Once you tire of disemboweling hapless fighter pilots and the TM tier beckons be sure to remember your wasps! As a newly emerging wing commander Wasps are your best friend. A few PACs/PBEs with wasps will enable your wing to eviscerate enemy fighters. Big bad Centaur on the prowl? Swarm him from afar with the combined power of your TM and fighters!

Nice Corvette! Wait! Why are you selling your wasps? Oh and what chance does that hammerhead have of making it through turret fire? Exactly, but if you fired a few wasps with it they might draw some fire. Tsk, management.

So you made it big time. Kudos. Lets get serious.
1 Fab makes 150/hour. Times 8K is 1200K. Times 5 Fabs is 6M.
Flails do 40K*8/hour is 320K. Times 5 Fabs is 1600K or 1.6M.
No comparisson.

The trick is deploying all that power simultaneously. 10K DPS from one ship just doesn't add up. But if you multiply that by 60 its 600K/s! Carriers.

Imagine what you could do with kind of firepower on high-spped M5s parented by a carrier. Gives me goose bumps.

More than likely it'd crash the game.

60 * 8 missiles = 480 missiles/volley.

Obviously some miss and get shot down but if a wasp cant make it what can?

Against destroyers slow fighters with large cargo bays would be better.

Kor'ah · Post by **Kor'ah** » Sat, 5. Jun 10, 05:01

Typhoon.

30k damage per warhead, 8x warheads, 240k total damage per missile, 3M cargo size and effective against anything that goes slower than 190m/s. A single Typhoon fab cranks out 6 per hour. So 5x fabs cranks out 7.2GJ of damage per hour.

EDIT: Come to think about it. Look into the Terran Rapier + Poltergiest combo. That M5 can carry 40x poltergiest and the missile auto retargets the nearest hostile once original target is dead. Expensive, but a even a single Poltergiest spaming Rapier can punch well above it's weight.

Dantrithor · Post by **Dantrithor** » Sat, 5. Jun 10, 05:33

Which is the reason why Scimitars + Poltergeists are my choice when playing around with carriers. The amount of damage they deal is plain insane, half the targets are blasted out of the sky long before the fighters get into guns range of anything.

Corporeal · Post by **Corporeal** » Sat, 5. Jun 10, 07:05

Have to admit I've never been into terran tech.
Only go in there with modded jump drive. Then only to pop them.

The targeting advantages are nice but its DPS is only 75% of a wasp, its slower, and twice the size. Shorter range too.

Unless missile damage is measured like gun damage. I thought it was per missile.

garv222 · Post by **garv222** » Sat, 5. Jun 10, 07:36

Did wasps get a range boost in 2.7? I've had poor performance from wasps on small targets. I'll sometimes get as bad performance as 6 of the missiles unable to hit due to them running out of fuel and self-detonating. They work fine for large targets, but I've had problems using them even on m3 if they are fast enough.

Targ Collective · Post by **Targ Collective** » Sat, 5. Jun 10, 07:47

Are those figures right? a self-sustaining complex in President's End should make about the same profit from Wasps, Hammers or Flails according to the Complex Calculator - all around 2.5mcr/hr. Wasp fabs are cheaper to build so your complex pays for itself much sooner, of course.

EmperorJon · Post by **EmperorJon** » Sat, 5. Jun 10, 09:46

Swarm missiles, with a comma.

foszae · Post by **foszae** » Sat, 5. Jun 10, 10:34

tough call, tough call. i've equipped the wasp a lot it's true. but the Hurricane. hmm. it's slower than a wasp but still faster than a HEPT (and almost all ships), has 75% extra range on the wasp, and maybe it is a single missile which is easier to shoot down. but if they shoot it down close to themselves, a hurricane is AREA EFFECT! and it's the damage of all six individual wasps hitting. still a size S missile if three times as much space. and i can't say exactly how fast the factory is, but i know i fitted out a Raptor's full 65 wing hangar in just a little while. who cares if you actually hit them if you can pound them just by getting it fast and close...

kurush · Post by **kurush** » Sat, 5. Jun 10, 20:27

Go and try clearing a wel-populated xenon sector with just wasps... Wasps have their place but mostly for fighters on commonwelth carriers. Typhoons, all Terran missiles, and M8/M7M missiles have uses you just can't accomplish with Wasps.

frickenmoron · Post by **frickenmoron** » Sat, 5. Jun 10, 21:10

I think the biggest bang award still goes to the shadow missile. 8x 755k is nothing to be laughed at really. I guess it's good that only one ship in the game can use it. I still don't get why it's a swarm missile, especially when the encyclopedia states that it's the Terran equivalent to the Hammer.

Cpt.Jericho · Post by **Cpt.Jericho** » Sat, 5. Jun 10, 21:27

Corporeal wrote:Nice Corvette! Wait! Why are you selling your wasps? Oh and what chance does that hammerhead have of making it through turret fire?

It doesn't have to

Fired one on a Pirate M6 and it made the mistake to shoot it down - well, they were not far enough from the blast

But if we talk about swarms: The Wraith does some nice fireworks

aladonahill · Post by **aladonahill** » Sat, 5. Jun 10, 21:28

I like to fire a larger, slower missile with a bigger payload at larger ships at about 10 km, and then cover it with a couple of wasps fired shortly afterward. Usually, the wasps will be enough of a distraction that the larger missile can slip in and hit the mark.

EnderIII · Post by **EnderIII** » Sat, 5. Jun 10, 21:33

frickenmoron wrote:I think the biggest bang award still goes to the shadow missile. 8x 755k is nothing to be laughed at really. I guess it's good that only one ship in the game can use it. I still don't get why it's a swarm missile, especially when the encyclopedia states that it's the Terran equivalent to the Hammer.

THIS.

The shadow is unstoppable.

1 missile launch can kill a Q.

ONE!

A barrage can clear a Xenon sector if everything is within range.

frickenmoron · Post by **frickenmoron** » Sat, 5. Jun 10, 21:45

Well, not really since the Shadow missiles only rarely hit smaller craft.
But yeah, you need 2 missiles for a K/J, one for a Q. 5 for a station and 7 for a shipyard. It's also my favorite for "removing" Tyrs that spawned with hull polarization.

jlehtone · Post by **jlehtone** » Sat, 5. Jun 10, 21:54

Corporeal wrote:Imagine what you could do with kind of firepower on high-spped M5s parented by a carrier. Gives me goose bumps.

More than likely it'd crash the game. 60 * 8 missiles = 480 missiles/volley.

65 Xenon L fighters test launch Wasps. The bypassing Teladi completely mostly ignored the literally thousands Wasp-warheads heading its way, but the framerate was momentarily knocked out.
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EmperorJon · Post by **EmperorJon** » Sat, 5. Jun 10, 22:01

That's nothing.

Using an M7M or M8 loaded with a missile, I barrage, and if you enter a big enough number it fires all of the missiles at the same time, constantly. And when you run out, it fires all of the missiles at the same time, constantly.

And 10 minutes later, it's firing all of the missiles at the same time, constantly.

It never stops. Until your computer dies.

brucewarren · Post by **brucewarren** » Sat, 5. Jun 10, 22:20

Now that finally I've got my paws on a Skirnrir I've been building those
Shadows you guys have been talking about.

Just for a laugh I tried a barrage of 20 in Legends home at an argon ship
to see what would happen.

Not only do they launch as fast as flails, possibly faster, not only do they
swarm, not only do they do an extraordinary amount of damage, but
they also re-aquire targets the way flails do as each one dies.

Within minutes the entire sector was dust. At this rate I just might
retire the overtuned hyperion.

garv222 · Post by **garv222** » Sun, 6. Jun 10, 02:44

One thing I've been itching to try for swarm missiles is a fleet of typhoon loaded medusa prototypes. Definitely on my to-do list...but far in the future since I've just restarted on a new game and I need to get the cure for the poisoned paranid before I even begin to plan out the hub plot.

bbenham · Post by **bbenham** » Mon, 7. Jun 10, 22:58

frickenmoron wrote:I think the biggest bang award still goes to the shadow missile. .

For the life of me, I can't find these suckers.. Where can I get them?

imperium3 · Post by **imperium3** » Mon, 7. Jun 10, 23:26

bbenham wrote:
frickenmoron wrote:I think the biggest bang award still goes to the shadow missile. .
For the life of me, I can't find these suckers.. Where can I get them?

In Terran sectors, if you're lucky. Else you can obtain them after a certain plot.

egosoft.com

egosoft.com

Wasps. With a period.

Wasps. With a period.

Re: Wasps. With a period.

Re: Wasps. With a period.