[IDEA] Double jump gates

J.I.Gorkij · Post by **J.I.Gorkij** » Sun, 5. Sep 10, 23:35

Have you ever been destroyed by M1/M2, which jump through gate just behind you? Have you ever tried to fly through jump gate in Atmosferic Lifter? Or your Panther blow up two small fighters every time upon leaving jumpgate?

I have counted it in my game (not quite sure, how many ships have Atmo Lifter crushed) - too much!

I have an idea for a mod that would divide jump gates in two parts (first for jumping in, second for jumping out) to ensure better safety when travelling (not only for player - i've seen examples of NPC vs. NPC crashes).

I tought that in/out cannot be divided, but some time ago I saw a mod, that spawn ships beyond gates, so maybe it is possible.

My problem is that I don't know anything about scripting and don't have enough time to learn it, otherwise I would try to do this myself.

Unserene · Post by **Unserene** » Mon, 6. Sep 10, 00:09

So, just like Freelancer then?

J.I.Gorkij · Post by **J.I.Gorkij** » Mon, 6. Sep 10, 00:19

Unserene wrote:So, just like Freelancer then?

Yes, something like this. But this time, every ring has only one function (one in, one out). In Freelancer, IIRC, player could use both rings...

Railgunner · Post by **Railgunner** » Mon, 6. Sep 10, 00:25

your referring to the Trade Lanes of Freelancer correct? They where designed to be space highways, not gates in and of themselves.......

J.I.Gorkij · Post by **J.I.Gorkij** » Mon, 6. Sep 10, 00:37

Railgunner wrote:your referring to the Trade Lanes of Freelancer correct? They where designed to be space highways, not gates in and of themselves.......

I know, but why have just one single gate and risk. It seems illogical to me.

Railgunner · Post by **Railgunner** » Mon, 6. Sep 10, 00:58

2 way wormhole, also think of the amount of trouble you would get if you tried to lock on to the gates!!! It would be nigh impossible to do.......

Tolmos · Post by **Tolmos** » Mon, 6. Sep 10, 02:06

Actually my first thought was two jumpgates- one for capital ships and one for smaller class vessels. One in one out works too >_>.

OR- a light on the top of the gate for the player so you know if someone is coming or not.

J.I.Gorkij · Post by **J.I.Gorkij** » Mon, 6. Sep 10, 02:09

Tolmos wrote:OR- a light on the top of the gate for the player so you know if someone is coming or not.

Well, that's nice idea too. When I first played X game, I thought it is signalling incoming ships.

But I don't think, that this modification can be done.

Tolmos · Post by **Tolmos** » Mon, 6. Sep 10, 02:40

J.I.Gorkij wrote:
Tolmos wrote:OR- a light on the top of the gate for the player so you know if someone is coming or not.
Well, that's nice idea too. When I first played X game, I thought it is signalling incoming ships.

But I don't think, that this modification can be done.

I wonder about that. Probably (VERY) difficult to implement, but the concept seems simple enough. Whenever a ship gets near the jumpgates as they are now, the runway lights activate. That means the jumpgates are basing their actions on the proximity of ships to that gate.

Now it seems to me that IF the jumpgates all specify what gates they lead to (for instance is there a script command to pull up from Kingdom End's south gate that it leads to Three Worlds north gate?"), then you could load all the gates into an array and have them check for their counterparts. Now, the computer does fine OOS, its just IS, particularly for the player ships, that the problem occurs. So really, the script wouldn't have to focus on more than 2 gates at any given time. Just have the light become active whenever the player ship reaches x kilometers from it. It would require the OOS gate it is attached to to refresh its information more often but only for that one sector.

Of course, I've gone and run my mouth about it and could be completely wrong. Even if that is remotely close to how to do it, I would say that would probably be difficult... but I'm not sure about impossible either way.

apricotslice · Post by **apricotslice** » Mon, 6. Sep 10, 03:24

If this was changeable, I think someone would have done it by now.

Most of the gate joinings are described in the map files. A few are done with MD files.

I suspect that most of the jump operation is hardcoded, and that collisions around the gates happen because the devs think that is real. You after all, are hogging the gate by being in a gate sized ship.

Seriously, if you are flying a cap ship, you should be doing point to point jumps, and avoiding the gates.

Triaxx2 · Post by **Triaxx2** » Mon, 6. Sep 10, 04:02

It would work fine in sectors with a maximum of three existing gates, because the engine limits sectors to 6 total gates.

Serial Kicked · Post by **Serial Kicked** » Mon, 6. Sep 10, 04:15

And good luck teaching the NPC ships how to use that correctly too

ThisIsHarsh · Post by **ThisIsHarsh** » Mon, 6. Sep 10, 05:48

Actually, from my experimentation with gates, I think the NPCs could handle separate incoming and outgoing gates just fine.

Gates can be spawned and reconfigured (i.e. destination changed) via script easily.

The limitation, as Triaxx2 says, is that there is only a maximum of 6 gates allowed per sector. Its still possible without destroying the game, if the player is willing to accept the reconfiguration of the gate network slightly (i.e. of all sectors with 4 gates).

Tolmos · Post by **Tolmos** » Mon, 6. Sep 10, 06:31

In that case, how about two gates:

1 for them and 1 for us.

I see no problem having my own gate...

S1lverhair · Post by **S1lverhair** » Mon, 6. Sep 10, 07:13

you could just let there be a front and back.
the front of the gate lets ships go in and the back lets ships come out.

vukica · Post by **vukica** » Mon, 6. Sep 10, 08:50

You don't need two gates. You need one gate and "something else" just to mark the spawn point for incoming ships.
So the gate on side A is not connected to the gate on side B. It's connected to the spawn point.

Now, this spawn point can look like a gate

TheEarl · Post by **TheEarl** » Mon, 6. Sep 10, 09:51

Maybe it can be handled like this:
A double-ring of gates, similar to freelancer tradelines.
One works like the old gate to fly in and jump away.
The other is the spawnpoint for incoming ships.
So its only one mesh and gate for the engine.

Post by **Ketraar** » Mon, 6. Sep 10, 11:26

2 Gates are not possible due 2 two things.

1. max. active connections per sector are 6. Most sectors would need 8, some even 12 (HUB).

2. No way to tell the NPC ship which one to use as you can't define directionality to them. IF one could define enter/exit gates it would have been possible and even have some impact, but having two gates would probably just divide the traffic, in the best case scenario.

MFG

Ketraar

TrixX · Post by **TrixX** » Mon, 6. Sep 10, 12:36

What about having the exit point out the back of the gate?

If that can be defined that is...

Would instantly remove all collision issues except the gates with long rear overhangs...

Happyblue · Post by **Happyblue** » Mon, 6. Sep 10, 12:47

Cadius is working on new warp gate models that are double thier current size. http://forum.egosoft.com/viewtopic.php?t=286162

Should fix your problem when he is done.