The last few games I bought all required accounts to install, play or both. I don't feel comfortable with that and have resolved not to buy anything with steam or other logon requirements.
Whether I have the willpower not to buy Rebirth is another matter, but I wanted to make it known that putting in the effort to implement an online activation component will most likely mean loss of at least this 1 sale.
Having said that, I've bought and played all the X games (twice over, with the superbox!) and know Egosoft is sensible with patching out this sort of thing, so if it cannot be avoided at RTM, then I'll certainly be looking out for a gold edition that just installs off a disk with no online hook.
Link to a poll regarding Steam requirement
Cheers.
Logon required to install/play?
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Logon required to install/play?
Last edited by Shimrod on Thu, 6. Oct 11, 12:06, edited 2 times in total.
Egosoft has been good about this in the past. I am not a fan of those systems either.
I would like to be able to directly download a disk image from Egosoft. It would cut out the middle man and give me a disk to keep for a backup instead of having to download again. I am sure someone over there would be screaming about pirating if they did something like that though.
I would like to be able to directly download a disk image from Egosoft. It would cut out the middle man and give me a disk to keep for a backup instead of having to download again. I am sure someone over there would be screaming about pirating if they did something like that though.
this is possibly the simplest answer Ego could give will the game require a steam (or other online account ) to play, Ego and DS must have sorted out that aspect at the begining of the contract or if not before anouncment.
not wanting another steam is good /steam is evel debate a simple question to ego
will i be able to play Rebirth just from disk with only game registration required to get tech help yes or no
not wanting another steam is good /steam is evel debate a simple question to ego
will i be able to play Rebirth just from disk with only game registration required to get tech help yes or no
I expect it will be something like steam works TBH, not as drm or to keep tabs on people but to simplify updates and also give the game a platform for advertisment to attract new players. You will be able to play it in steam (offline mod) tough i would gaurantee.
Always makes me think how credible peoples purchases are when they try and avoid steam like the plaugue, there is nothing wrong with steam (and other leading online games stores), so why avoid it unless using a less than legal copy of the game.
Always makes me think how credible peoples purchases are when they try and avoid steam like the plaugue, there is nothing wrong with steam (and other leading online games stores), so why avoid it unless using a less than legal copy of the game.
I used to list PC parts here, but "the best" will suffice!
I have issues with steam. I can't easily work out compatibility issues with steam which can be a problem on XP 64 which I use. I have had issues with steam depending on SSD vs IDE drives before. Everything is just a layer deeper making it that much worse to fix. Steam has closed accounts in the past, effectively turning their purchases into rentals. It is another thing that can be hacked. I would just rather keep my own copy.dougeye wrote:Always makes me think how credible peoples purchases are when they try and avoid steam like the plaugue, there is nothing wrong with steam (and other leading online games stores), so why avoid it unless using a less than legal copy of the game.
i will be very upset if they DONT offer it on steam.
That said, i can see how you could be upset if they force you to use one service (i flat out refuse to play Battle feild 3 if i have to use origin, never heard of a person who has had a good experience with EA in situations like that)
overall, i find that
A) steams DRM is some of the best in the business, never had a problem with it, and some companies refuse to not use any DRM.. so steams seems a good middle ground
B) i have heard of peoples steam accounts getting closed, but only in extreme situations, such as Credit card fraud.
C) seeing as how Egosoft (who, i would say have a SMALL EGO) removed the DRM totally from X3TC.. it wouldn't surprise me to see the same thing happen with X:R, where it comes out with DRM, and after the game has peaked, they remove it.
That said, i can see how you could be upset if they force you to use one service (i flat out refuse to play Battle feild 3 if i have to use origin, never heard of a person who has had a good experience with EA in situations like that)
overall, i find that
A) steams DRM is some of the best in the business, never had a problem with it, and some companies refuse to not use any DRM.. so steams seems a good middle ground
B) i have heard of peoples steam accounts getting closed, but only in extreme situations, such as Credit card fraud.
C) seeing as how Egosoft (who, i would say have a SMALL EGO) removed the DRM totally from X3TC.. it wouldn't surprise me to see the same thing happen with X:R, where it comes out with DRM, and after the game has peaked, they remove it.
Jovianmoon wrote:Are we ready to collide with that asteroid?apricotslice wrote:...auto-pillok...
Yes sir! Engaging auto-pillock!
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Knetter_Gek
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Also, Steam doesn't mean DRM must be in - it can. I have got several games on steam where you get the updates through steam but if you just copy the whole game folder over to another PC you can play it on there as well. So it needn't mean that the game will be locked in this "box" called Steam you can only get to with your Steam credentials and a working internet comnnection.corhen wrote: A) steams DRM is some of the best in the business, never had a problem with it, and some companies refuse to not use any DRM.. so steams seems a good middle ground
I agree. Egosoft has proven over and over to be very mindful of what their users want and if it turns out the steam distro really is a pain in the neck, I have no doubt they will take measures. They're not EA or Activision, give them some creditC) seeing as how Egosoft (who, i would say have a SMALL EGO) removed the DRM totally from X3TC.. it wouldn't surprise me to see the same thing happen with X:R, where it comes out with DRM, and after the game has peaked, they remove it.
We are all explorers of the deepest reaches of space.
We don't just watch space on our monitors and listen to the sounds in it:
We, all of us, each and every one of us, owns, to a man, as many operational Space Shuttles as NASA does.
Yes, we're all that awesome. Give yourself a hug.
We don't just watch space on our monitors and listen to the sounds in it:
We, all of us, each and every one of us, owns, to a man, as many operational Space Shuttles as NASA does.
Yes, we're all that awesome. Give yourself a hug.
It was my 3rd Steam purchase I became concerned at how much vested interest I was potentially going to build up with it.
I wouldn't mind if it was simply a download manager, but the fact it wants to be running, requires a logon, downloads stuff automatically, talks about my account being in 'good standing', feels invasive and I'm not comfortable with it.
I've cut my losses and uninstalled Steam, and with it Civ5, New Vegas and Supcom2. I just don't want it on my machine.
I consider it a fair proposition to require logon or validation to download additional content beyond initial purchase, although I feel bugfixes should be made available without strings as goodwill.
I wouldn't mind if it was simply a download manager, but the fact it wants to be running, requires a logon, downloads stuff automatically, talks about my account being in 'good standing', feels invasive and I'm not comfortable with it.
I've cut my losses and uninstalled Steam, and with it Civ5, New Vegas and Supcom2. I just don't want it on my machine.
I consider it a fair proposition to require logon or validation to download additional content beyond initial purchase, although I feel bugfixes should be made available without strings as goodwill.
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GCU Grey Area
- Posts: 7825
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I have several answers to that.dougeye wrote:Always makes me think how credible peoples purchases are when they try and avoid steam like the plaugue, there is nothing wrong with steam (and other leading online games stores), so why avoid it unless using a less than legal copy of the game.
1. Don't have the fastest internet connection on the planet so it takes several times longer to download games than it does to install from disk, even accounting for the hour long walk it takes to get into town & back.
2. My internet connection has a monthly usage cap. Downloading a game (often several Gb) runs the risk of exceeding that. Steam has a nasty habit of downloading the entire game even if there's a disk with all the data on it sitting in the drive.
3. Patches - Steam wants to apply them even if I don't. My favourite version of TC is 2.1 (i.e. before they messed up using an M6 for boarding). Therefore I like to keep multiple installations patched to different levels. As I understand it this is difficult to do if Steam is involved.
As a consequence of these & other issues I do my best to avoid Steam. Doesn't always work (have bought a few games where the Steam requirement was printed in impossibly small text on the back of the box) but my experience of Steam has been almost entirely negative so will continue to do so.
Source: http://www.thegamersblog.com/review/egosoft-interview/TGB: Many previous PC exclusive developers have complained that piracy is a big problem for them and have moved away from the PC platform as a whole in some cases. Do you, as a developer, feel piracy is a huge problem for you?
Bernd Lehahn: Piracy sure harms us, but I think we found a good compromise in how we protected our last two games (and in how we removed that protection afterwards). It is always impossible to judge how much more we could sell, but I do not believe any developer moves to another platform just because of this. Consoles are a big market and developers would be stupid not to develop games for this market.
I don't think we need to worry about online activation. If it was required I wouldn't buy the game, no matter how good is. (Just like AC2, SC2 and Diablo3)
Well, it is the pirates fault that companies have to resort to that, and in the end, all the good consumers sufferVayde wrote:All games need copy protection, it gives their developers a false sense of security until the first copy and crack appear within 24 hours of launch.
Also for those of us with access to credit and debit cards steam is not an issue but for those who don't
I will abide by whichever anti-piracy Egosoft wants to implement. I have no problem with it because I will most definitely buy this game.
Hi,
Just to reiterate the intent of my OP is primarily to raise awareness with the developer, that a mandatory online component (including steamworks) is unwelcome in some quarters of the customer base and a barrier to sales. Follow up discussion tends to confirm I'm not alone in that segment.
I'm not aiming for a debate on the merits of DRM in general, I don't think that'll be productive in this context and will only lead to contention. Just want to get over my primary message.
Cheers
Just to reiterate the intent of my OP is primarily to raise awareness with the developer, that a mandatory online component (including steamworks) is unwelcome in some quarters of the customer base and a barrier to sales. Follow up discussion tends to confirm I'm not alone in that segment.
I'm not aiming for a debate on the merits of DRM in general, I don't think that'll be productive in this context and will only lead to contention. Just want to get over my primary message.
Cheers
with steam works though im sure its possible for the develpoer to give you the option so that the game does not require steam to be running but if you choose you can register the product with steam to optain auto patches etc.
+Steam closing accounts, basicly if this happened without sufficient reason in the UK trading standards laws would intervene as it is essentially theft, like buying a car and the showroom takes it back and sais you cant drive it.
+Steam closing accounts, basicly if this happened without sufficient reason in the UK trading standards laws would intervene as it is essentially theft, like buying a car and the showroom takes it back and sais you cant drive it.
I used to list PC parts here, but "the best" will suffice!
with steam works though im sure its possible for the develpoer to give you the option so that the game does not require steam to be running but if you choose you can register the product with steam to optain auto patches etc.
Certainly if there's an option that doesn't require steam to be installed at all, then I'll be buying. Assuming there's no other kind of online hook.
i am sorry steam anything and its a no sale all i want is to buy a disk and install, i dont care if i have to leave the disk in to start or to play i just do not anything to do with an online service of any sort.
i have to download patches at work as my internet at home is only slightly better than pony express and is as reliable as a teenager.
yes steam may be great if you live where a real broadband exists but i dont.
i dont need to buy this game it wont kill me if i dont so its a simple question will it be like previouse titles or will those of us with s**t broadband have to miss out how hard can that be to answer ?
i have to download patches at work as my internet at home is only slightly better than pony express and is as reliable as a teenager.
yes steam may be great if you live where a real broadband exists but i dont.
i dont need to buy this game it wont kill me if i dont so its a simple question will it be like previouse titles or will those of us with s**t broadband have to miss out how hard can that be to answer ?
not being harsh at all but if making the game available on a platfrom like steam makes it easier and normally cheaper for people to obtain, why should they suffer for a few people with bad internet? TBH this topic is a non isue because i know for a fact that X-Rebirth will be available on disk and im sure egosoft have not lost the ethical compass when it comes to DRM's etc but unfortuantly if the product is not proteced he company will loose housands of euro's/pounds/dollars in piracy, which is fair compared o loosing a few people wiv bad broadband. harsh i know! (no personal).
I used to list PC parts here, but "the best" will suffice!
A game can be distributed via Steam and DVD independently. X3:TC is an example of this. The key difference is the latest crop of games employ 'Steamworks integration' such that the DVD version is effectively the Steam version with some of the files supplied on DVD instead of downloaded. The user must create a Steam account to install and/or play.not being harsh at all but if making the game available on a platfrom like steam makes it easier and normally cheaper for people to obtain, why should they suffer for a few people with bad internet?
It does not follow that lack of Steamworks integration in the game puts Steam users at a disadvantage. The game may still be purchased through Steam.
As above, if the game employs 'Steamworks integration' then the disk version is effectively the Steam version, and will have an online component for install/logon. It does not follow that the topic is a non issue.TBH this topic is a non isue because i know for a fact that X-Rebirth will be available on disk
The topic is not requesting that DRM should be omitted from the product.unfortuantly if the product is not proteced he company will loose housands of euro's/pounds/dollars in piracy, which is fair compared o loosing a few people wiv bad broadband. harsh i know! (no personal)