X3AP: assasination missions on M8s?

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sigma1987
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X3AP: assasination missions on M8s?

Post by sigma1987 » Thu, 29. Dec 11, 07:59

Hi forums, it's been awhile.

I picked up X3: Albion prelude the other day on steam, and I've been unable to stop playing it since. Good job, Egosoft.

Anyways, my question:
Whenever I take an assassination mission and my target is in an M8, They usually blow themselves up by launching missiles while taking fire from me. This kills them rather spectacularly, but then the mission gets aborted because the game doesn't recognize the kill as mine. Has this been fixed in a mod, and/or are the developers aware of it? It kind of breaks those missions.

pjknibbs
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Post by pjknibbs » Thu, 29. Dec 11, 08:06

It's not classed as a bug, as far as I know, and it has always worked like that--if a ship blows itself up with its own missiles it is not classed as your kill. I suspect it's difficult for the game engine to know that the missiles blew up because your fire hit them and not, for example, because some random third party's lasers did the job!

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Re: X3AP: assasination missions on M8s?

Post by Jumee » Thu, 29. Dec 11, 08:31

sigma1987 wrote:Hi forums, it's been awhile.

I picked up X3: Albion prelude the other day on steam, and I've been unable to stop playing it since. Good job, Egosoft.

Anyways, my question:
Whenever I take an assassination mission and my target is in an M8, They usually blow themselves up by launching missiles while taking fire from me. This kills them rather spectacularly, but then the mission gets aborted because the game doesn't recognize the kill as mine. Has this been fixed in a mod, and/or are the developers aware of it? It kind of breaks those missions.
this has been asked quite a few times the only thing you can do is not attack them in their "face" attack from bottom/top/back

sigma1987
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Post by sigma1987 » Thu, 29. Dec 11, 08:41

Might be a good idea for a mod then. I'll have to find out if it's even possible. I'm thinking make it so that assassination missions trigger as complete if either the player or the target kills the target, the latter case is how I imagine "blew himself up with his missiles" could be detected.

Vim Razz
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Post by Vim Razz » Thu, 29. Dec 11, 08:43

Knocking them out with big missiles seems to be the only reliable way to be sure you get credit for the kill that I've found, atm.

Even focusing on the back/top, they blow up a lot when you shoot them with guns.

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RandomBandit
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Post by RandomBandit » Thu, 29. Dec 11, 08:45

yeah, long standing problem that could be fixed with "missiles killed by weapons dont detonate their payload" but it never has been. Missiles dont explode when fired at...it is move-logic at play, like cars exploding when you shoot the gas tank.
Shoot them and it 'kills' them by trashing their guidance, or tearing their propulsion to shreds...there is no need for the charge to go off...
Last edited by RandomBandit on Thu, 29. Dec 11, 09:03, edited 1 time in total.
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Catra
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Post by Catra » Thu, 29. Dec 11, 08:56

if missiles had impervious armor...
why isnt -every- ship equipped with this armor?
=P
Just saying it forward: I give everyone 2 posts to make good, in context posts(proper english, as always, is optional). After that I'm ignoring what you have to say in that thread that's directed to what we previously were talking about.

Bobucles
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Post by Bobucles » Thu, 29. Dec 11, 14:29

Catra wrote:if missiles had impervious armor...
why isnt -every- ship equipped with this armor?
=P
Because it explosively reacts with oxygen? :D

sigma1987
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Post by sigma1987 » Thu, 29. Dec 11, 16:49

Catra wrote:if missiles had impervious armor...
why isnt -every- ship equipped with this armor?
=P
Same reason every ship doesn't move at 500 m/s.

grumman
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Post by grumman » Thu, 29. Dec 11, 17:27

pjknibbs wrote:I suspect it's difficult for the game engine to know that the missiles blew up because your fire hit them and not, for example, because some random third party's lasers did the job!
If the game engine can identify who destroyed a ship, it should be able to identify who destroyed a missile. I'd suggest giving credit for kills if you fired the missile or you destroyed the missile, but only assigning blame if you fired the missile.

The two logic paths would be something like this:
ship destroyed - destroyed by projectile - projectile owned by N - N gets credit.
ship destroyed - destroyed by projectile - projectile destroyed by N - N gets credit.
Grumman - killjoy extraordinaire

Virtualaughing
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Post by Virtualaughing » Thu, 29. Dec 11, 18:08

Sorry for the example but....

In Freelancer multiplayer servers every shoot and every "bullet" is calculated by the game engine can recognise whoever made the final hit or so. I don't think that is impossible for X games to find out the difference.
but...
As the owner of that missile it indeed killed himslef..... Not to mention the annoyance when an NPC steal a kill of yours

I would like to hear a dev says anything about it. Until that for me every other answer is just a speculation...
X to X3 is MENU SUPERIOR!
I think Egosoft has already worked out our doom, because Xenon AI will reach the stars! :D

cfehunter
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Post by cfehunter » Thu, 29. Dec 11, 18:31

I imagine it wouldn't be that hard to fix the code.

Because of how the game works we can assume that projectiles have an owner.

Otherwise ships wouldn't be able to react to you shooting them.

So couldn't you just do something along the lines of changeing the owner of the explosion to the ship that shot down the missile?

So.

Ship A launches a missile.

missile owner is A.

Ship B shoots down the missile. Missile hull hits 0
missile owner is now B. Any ship that takes damage from it will blame the ship that shot it down.

sigma1987
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Post by sigma1987 » Thu, 29. Dec 11, 19:18

This all sounds pretty reasonable. I'd also like to hear from a dev/ a modder with their opinion on whether this is plausible. If the question's been asked a couple times it's probably worth working on.

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Gazz
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Post by Gazz » Thu, 29. Dec 11, 19:23

My complete script download page. . . . . . I AM THE LAW!
There is no sense crying over every mistake. You just keep on trying till you run out of cake.

swatti
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Post by swatti » Thu, 29. Dec 11, 19:44

Simple solution:

Missiles immortal/indestructible for 2secs after launch. All missiles.

Finetuning:
Powerfull AOE-missiles & Torpedoes need X-secs to "arm" themselfs to do any dmg.

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Spectre01
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Post by Spectre01 » Thu, 29. Dec 11, 20:07

Gazz wrote:http://forum.egosoft.com/viewtopic.php?t=238860

Use it or don't. *shrug*
They should make this into bonus pack.

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RandomBandit
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Post by RandomBandit » Thu, 29. Dec 11, 21:40

There you go Swatti...an explanation for my simple-fix idea.

Missiles don't arm until they are just about to strike their target.

With station owners and pilots alike getting sick of getting killed by stray, or their OWN, missiles this safety measure was implemented on all missiles.

everyone wins and there is no need for the CPU to keep track of extra timers or damage sources.
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fgabriel26
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Post by fgabriel26 » Thu, 29. Dec 11, 21:58

I'm having more problems with L capture mission. They fire missles when you are hitting them not when they see hostiles. And they shouldn't be able to target ennemy at their 6 that's kind of annoying. :evil:

swatti
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Post by swatti » Thu, 29. Dec 11, 22:03

And when they miss? Its a nuke on lose, who knows how many ppl might die and stuff...

Making missiles immortal for like 2 seconds after launch gives you the ability of launching missiles when surraunded by drones for example

For larger missiles id go for your idea.

Got a law-enforcement lisence and im shocked, its not the money, but seriously, im been fighting xenon and its like im one-shotting them, this is just stupid!

EGOSOFT, GO PLAY YOUR GAME! Spawn a ten Xenon Ns and see if you can kill EVEN ONE by shooting its hull down to 0%. Take it as a challenge.
Seriously, i havent been fighting much but i doubt theres any point in it.

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RandomBandit
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Post by RandomBandit » Thu, 29. Dec 11, 22:04

fgabriel26 wrote:I'm having more problems with L capture mission. They fire missles when you are hitting them not when they see hostiles. And they shouldn't be able to target ennemy at their 6 that's kind of annoying. :evil:
360 radar, it is handy for them...also, missiles can fire sideways for all space cares...hitting stuff behind you is a great use of missiles.
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