X3TC/AP Station Blueprints

[ConCorDian]

i was just wondering, why cant we RE/Scan (or just buy the blueprints) a station and then build our own stations with the PHQ?

surely all the mechanics are in place it would just be a matter of giving them resource values required to build. for most stations it would'nt really help, but then take into acount say an Argon player in AP who has captured Terran ships and now wants to get more weapons. we could get th blueprints and build our own small complex if we could (might also allow us to get those IBL forges or perhaps a second PHQ albeit taking a hell of a long time) we could make our own weapons rather than counting on drops and other captures in order to get enough.

[CBJ]

surely all the mechanics are in place...

The HQ functionality as it stands places the built item into a docking bay, which wouldn't be terribly useful for a station. I believe it also makes a number of other assumptions based on the built item being a ship, so it's almost there but not quite.

[kurush]

The HQ functionality as it stands places the built item into a docking bay, which wouldn't be terribly useful for a station. I believe it also makes a number of other assumptions based on the built item being a ship, so it's almost there but not quite.

Hmmm, I remember in TC I was "conjuring" those stations via PHQ by changing the code of a ship in the production queue to that of a station using a memory editor. And after being produced, the station was placed in the PHQ storage just fine. The same was true for guns. This part of mechanics apparently is in the game.

[Kirlack]

Maybe it's a function we'll see in a PHQ (or PHQ like station) in Rebirth, and CBJ is deliberately obfuscating the point

[kurush]

Maybe it's a function we'll see in a PHQ (or PHQ like station) in Rebirth, and CBJ is deliberately obfuscating the point

What I was trying to say is that the function apparently *is* in the current game as well. It is just nobody bothered to implement a mission or another way to obtain those station blueprints. I am actually amazed how many such features are lost because they were implemented but weren't enabled in the end product. Think of the development effort spent and essentially wasted. *sigh*. This is essentially a trademark of our venerable space-sim vendor You think it won't be a pattern for Rebirth?

[RoverTX]

http://www.xai-corp.net/en/node/3508

The above mod actually allows you to add anything to the PHQ as a blueprint. Though I stil haven't tested it because of work. I took this mod and modded it a little bit to just add Stations to the PHQ. All you have to do is have one in storage at the PHQ and it can then take it and reverse eng it for a fee. Its through a different interface for the REing then the ship one, but the building is the same. I use this with a modded version of Ccrowys equipment research script that allows for ship upgrades to make my PHQ a real centralized HQ.

[kurush]

A mod is a bit too much for the functionality that is essentially already in the game. The same thing can obviously be done with just a script as somebody pointed here . Why it is not in vanilla? Probably because nobody bothered to create a signable script or MD mission that adds it. We could use a nasty mission from Yaki that would give us some IBL forge blueprints Something like capture and bring us Argon One and we will share the blueprints with you

[jkjklkl]

We could use a nasty mission from Yaki that would give us some IBL forge blueprints Something like capture and bring us Argon One and we will share the blueprints with you

Then we could use the same #deca trick to get our own Argon One, complete with Betty soundtrack on the info screen.

[CBJ]

Hmmm, I remember in TC I was "conjuring" those stations via PHQ by changing the code of a ship in the production queue to that of a station using a memory editor. And after being produced, the station was placed in the PHQ storage just fine. The same was true for guns. This part of mechanics apparently is in the game.

I just took another look and you're right. Funny thing that because even though I wrote that bit of code myself, I have no memory whatsoever all of having done so! It was nearly 5 years ago though, so perhaps I can be forgiven.

It is just nobody bothered to implement a mission or another way to obtain those station blueprints.

Developers have deadlines to meet, and sometimes tough decisions have to be made about what features to finish for the final product given the time available. This isn't the only HQ feature that has suffered that fate over the years. Your implication that this happens as a result of laziness or apathy on the part of the developers is really quite insulting, so I'd appreciate it if you kept those insinuations to yourself in future.

[SanguineHaze]

Your implication that this happens as a result of laziness or apathy on the part of the developers is really quite insulting, so I'd appreciate it if you kept those insinuations to yourself in future.

To be fair, most gamers genuinely do not know how a game goes from Imagination to Physical Copy. Even fewer have been in a situation where they truly understand development timelines. Try not to take it too personally, most people assume that developers have as much time as they want.

[kurush]

Your implication that this happens as a result of laziness or apathy on the part of the developers is really quite insulting, so I'd appreciate it if you kept those insinuations to yourself in future.

I can hardly suspect developers in laziness, so I probably used some wrong language that got you ticked off. I was trying to say that nobody was interested in implementing a singable script or MD mission to get those blueprints available in vanilla. That does not really imply developers in any way, does it?
In my projects half-implemented features usually happen because of screwed up planning and lack of design, but of course I must be unique in this

[RoverTX]

@ kurush what you links is also a mod, in a matter of fact is mods the same file, the hq types file.

[kurush]

@ kurush what you links is also a mod, in a matter of fact is mods the same file, the hq types file.

As far as I can see, hq.xml is referenced as the place where to change how fast your stuff is produced while lasers and other wares are added via simple script. I'm actually about to try writing one to test in my game.

[RoverTX]

You need to add

<factor class="station" value="1" />

to the tag

<production time="xxx" money="xxx" resources="xxx">

From what I understand, thats why it will always require a little mod work.

[kurush]

From what I understand, thats why it will always require a little mod work.

Bummer, that explains why there is no signable script then I wonder whether I need to start a new game for hq.xml changes...

[RoverTX]

Only if you have created your PHQ already I believe.

You also need to add this to the hq file

<factor class="station" value="5000" />

Under the following tag

<resource typename="SS_WARE_TECH231">

[A5PECT]

This is essentially a trademark of our venerable space-sim vendor You think it won't be a pattern for Rebirth?

Every company drops volumes of conceptual and embryonic content before the final release of a product. The cutting room floor is part of the development process, and for video games it's filled wall-to-wall.

For Egosoft I imagine it's mostly stability and performance issues caused by X3s aging engine. Rebirth has a new one, so it will likely be much more adaptable.

[kurush]

For Egosoft I imagine it's mostly stability and performance issues caused by X3s aging engine. Rebirth has a new one, so it will likely be much more adaptable.

You have a good imagination then I can't imaging how performance concerns would relate to something produced on your HQ. It is not a script running on half of the ships in the game after all. Time constraints are obviously a factor here, but it is amazing how much unpublished stuff you can uncover in X via some hacking. I don't remember finding that much cut content in any other games.

[ConCorDian]

I just took another look and you're right. Funny thing that because even though I wrote that bit of code myself, I have no memory whatsoever all of having done so! It was nearly 5 years ago though, so perhaps I can be forgiven.

does this mean that for someone like yourself (or EGOSOFT as a whole) that this functionality could be added with relative ease? because if that is the case i think you could make a good few people happy with having this brought in.... then of course you would be forgiven

Developers have deadlines to meet, and sometimes tough decisions have to be made about what features to finish for the final product given the time available. This isn't the only HQ feature that has suffered that fate over the years. Your implication that this happens as a result of laziness or apathy on the part of the developers is really quite insulting, so I'd appreciate it if you kept those insinuations to yourself in future.

as Kurush has said perhaps wording hasn't been implemented correctly here but overal the point is valid. its true to pretty much the entire Entertainment industry, look at Movies/TV how many hours of work can be put in to bring a show or new special effect etc into fruitation and it be pulled at the last moment.. and in many cases the time required to finnish the job compaired to how much time has already been spent on it can be tiny in comparison, its a shame at times and it does come across as a waste of money (money is time after all) but i do understand that deadlines and so on still have to be met and its not down to just "we cant be arsed finnishing it"

For Egosoft I imagine it's mostly stability and performance issues caused by X3s aging engine. Rebirth has a new one, so it will likely be much more adaptable.

You have a good imagination then I can't imaging how performance concerns would relate to something produced on your HQ. It is not a script running on half of the ships in the game after all. Time constraints are obviously a factor here, but it is amazing how much unpublished stuff you can uncover in X via some hacking. I don't remember finding that much cut content in any other games.

Klo is probably right here, dont forget he did not say that this function itself was dropped due to preformance issues, but it still could have been due to stability, lets face it something like a tiny script can crash the game. AND i definatly think he is correct about the cutting room floor point. a lot of game developers will probably remove the functions they did not have complete from the coding entirely... EGOSOFT leave their game open for modding which is great, so a lot of these "unfinnished" parts you speak of being left in is kind of good in that aspect. for someone who understands the coding involved these little parts are kind of gifts..

To be fair, most gamers genuinely do not know how a game goes from Imagination to Physical Copy. Even fewer have been in a situation where they truly understand development timelines. Try not to take it too personally, most people assume that developers have as much time as they want.

i actually find this quite insulting, perhaps i dont know the technical stuff about coding and so on... but the largest part of the population now a days have to work to timescales... pretty much every shop on your local highstreet has similar issues, getting stock from suppliers to their shelves before the demand for it passes... the workers in these stores should understand this, if they dont its more ignorance from the individual than that of understanding. what most people will struggle to grasp at times with games development/software development is how to place any sort of intrinsic value to the work... this is largly due to the fact that the product sits as lines of code rather than a physical entity.

[kurush]

does this mean that for someone like yourself (or EGOSOFT as a whole) that this functionality could be added with relative ease? because if that is the case i think you could make a good few people happy with having this brought in.... then of course you would be forgiven

As RoverTX explained to us in this thread, this functionality requires both a bit of modding and some scripting (or perhaps MD coding). Because of this modding obstacle, it is unlikely to find its way in vanilla unless Ego decides to spend effort and finish that part, unlikely after so many years. It looks like mods for this are already available though...