So I built 3 lasertowers for one of the quests in AP... and for some reason they turned red to me, even though I'm quite friendly with the Argons that now own them. First of all, any idea how that happened? Pirate hackers, or just a bug?
Anyway, now I need to remove them. I have a fairly significant cashflow, but since I'm playing DiD, there's no quick reloading to try different strategies. And I've been waiting/searching around for a while for hacker quests to make them neutral to me, but haven't found any and I'm not sure they'll show up.
I haven't used many missiles, but it seems like firestorm/hammerhead missiles are probably the way to go to take out lasertowers... though I found out they don't work very well alone. I figure a cloud of drones and a hammerhead could probably take out a single lasertower for about 100k. But what's the most efficient strategy for multiple towers? Can beefed up fighters take them down safely? Is a good missile strategy cheap enough that you should use that before simply saving up for a big enough ship to crush them? My Dragon doesn't seem powerful enough to necessarily take one on, and it's certainly not maneuverable enough to fight one with 2 others in close proximity.
Best anti-lasertower strategies?
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Playbahnosh
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Solomon Short
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LTs only defend themselves against missiles actually targeted on them, you can use this against them.
Step 1) Select a slowish (i.e. not Mosquito or Hurricane) missile with less range than the one(s) you actually want to hit the LT(s) with.
Step 2) Move directly away from the LTs until the closest one is outside the range of the missile you chose in step 1.
Step 3) Stop & point your ship one of the LTs, then down a bit (this makes the next step easier).
Step 4) Launch the missile from step 1 at the LT.
Step 5) Target the missile you just launched.
Step 6) Fire enough missiles that have the range to hit the LT to take it out, these not go faster than the missile they're target at, but if they do, fire a few extras.
Step 7) Rinse & repeat from Step 4 for each additional LT you need to kill.
Note: It generally pays to ensure there's nothing between you & the LTs, because once the initial decoy missile self-destructs or gets shot down, the remainder will just keep going like a slow laser (you want to avoid them being shot down, because the beam might take out some of the followers).
This is a slow, but effective method, I usually lead with a decoy Hornet (225m/s, 24km range), followed by a couple of Firestorms or Hammerheads (160m/s-205m/s, 80+km range) from around 35km.
Edit: To avoid rep loss, have a 2nd ship nearby, & jump the ship that launches the missiles to another sector, without the player onboard, before they hit (there have been reports you sometimes still take the blame, but IME that's only happened if the ship was still IS when the missiles hit).
Step 1) Select a slowish (i.e. not Mosquito or Hurricane) missile with less range than the one(s) you actually want to hit the LT(s) with.
Step 2) Move directly away from the LTs until the closest one is outside the range of the missile you chose in step 1.
Step 3) Stop & point your ship one of the LTs, then down a bit (this makes the next step easier).
Step 4) Launch the missile from step 1 at the LT.
Step 5) Target the missile you just launched.
Step 6) Fire enough missiles that have the range to hit the LT to take it out, these not go faster than the missile they're target at, but if they do, fire a few extras.
Step 7) Rinse & repeat from Step 4 for each additional LT you need to kill.
Note: It generally pays to ensure there's nothing between you & the LTs, because once the initial decoy missile self-destructs or gets shot down, the remainder will just keep going like a slow laser (you want to avoid them being shot down, because the beam might take out some of the followers).
This is a slow, but effective method, I usually lead with a decoy Hornet (225m/s, 24km range), followed by a couple of Firestorms or Hammerheads (160m/s-205m/s, 80+km range) from around 35km.
Edit: To avoid rep loss, have a 2nd ship nearby, & jump the ship that launches the missiles to another sector, without the player onboard, before they hit (there have been reports you sometimes still take the blame, but IME that's only happened if the ship was still IS when the missiles hit).
@Playbahnosh: Sounds tempting, though I know they tore through the Dragon's shields extremely quickly. I bum rushed the station the first time with my docking computer, figuring finishing one part of the quest might turn them friendly. Alas, it didn't... and I barely made it out alive with an insta-jump after I undocked.
Unfortunately it's DiD mode, so I'm less tempted to make an assault unless I'm quite sure I have a chance (though that example I just gave was fun and exciting). And the 3 lasertowers are actually in an intelligent position because I put them there. They're all basically in range of each other, but covered by the base so that only something with an M3 agility or better could get around to them easily in close combat. So unless you were sitting at full range against one of them and soaking up that damage, you're pretty much getting attacked by 3 at a time. My own darn tactics turned against me.
@Solomon: Since I don't use missiles much, that was kind of what I was wondering. Hammerheads do 1.2M potentially, and the towers only have 1M shields and little hull/weapons. But it sounds like your strategy would cost ~200k to remove each tower. That's not a huge deal, my trade ships pull in ~10 million per hour played. But then, how much would it cost to buy/outfit a ship that could solo one? It's probably still cheaper over the long run to use a good missile strategy since my ~10 million ship doesn't seem to be able to take one out safely. And you could take out a lot of towers with 40 million worth of missiles instead of worrying about saving up for a big enough ship.
Unfortunately it's DiD mode, so I'm less tempted to make an assault unless I'm quite sure I have a chance (though that example I just gave was fun and exciting). And the 3 lasertowers are actually in an intelligent position because I put them there. They're all basically in range of each other, but covered by the base so that only something with an M3 agility or better could get around to them easily in close combat. So unless you were sitting at full range against one of them and soaking up that damage, you're pretty much getting attacked by 3 at a time. My own darn tactics turned against me.
@Solomon: Since I don't use missiles much, that was kind of what I was wondering. Hammerheads do 1.2M potentially, and the towers only have 1M shields and little hull/weapons. But it sounds like your strategy would cost ~200k to remove each tower. That's not a huge deal, my trade ships pull in ~10 million per hour played. But then, how much would it cost to buy/outfit a ship that could solo one? It's probably still cheaper over the long run to use a good missile strategy since my ~10 million ship doesn't seem to be able to take one out safely. And you could take out a lot of towers with 40 million worth of missiles instead of worrying about saving up for a big enough ship.
Last edited by Arqane on Mon, 13. Aug 12, 14:47, edited 1 time in total.
Well, now you're also starting to talk about a decent amount of money. So it sounds like a pretty decent and fun competition. Who can take out 20 lasertowers using the least amount of credits? Of course, I'm not sure you'd ever find that many in the game that you'd have to remove... so the cheapest strategy for 1-3 towers is probably best anyway. But it's an interesting competition anyway.
Well, there are always a few options, let's look at them. 
1) Higher range. If the tower is using the Plasma Beam Cannon (5.85km) and given its shields, a Photon Pulse Cannon (6.62km) or Point Singularity Projector (6.42km) should work fine. Missiles have by far a greater range, but they can be shot down. The downside is how much money you have to invest in a ship able to carry this weapon and the weapon itself, costing 1 Mio each. The Xenon Q and the Boron Thresher are the only non-M1/M2 able to equip it. But you will keep all your investments, beyond buying it there won't be further costs.
2) High shields. Just shoot it down while having enough shields to take all the damage. I don't think anything lower than capital ships can manage that against three Lasertowers at once. But once you have one, you can as well go ahead and use 1). Expensive to buy, though. Usually an M7 should also work, but in DiD I wouldn't risk it. If anything goes wrong, you couldn't retreat fast enough.
3) Hard-to-hit Drones. Send something that is hard to hit while it does a constant stream of damage. A mix of Fighter Drones (MK1 + MK2, since MK1 is way faster) should be enough, but that takes time and there is still the risk of them getting shot down. You can help with Missiles or even use the drones as decoy while sending something really nasty, something like a Firestorm torpedo or two. That would also decimate your drones though. The costs are moderate I think, but you don't have to invest more than a million.
4) Missile spam. Fire a few heavy torpedos and distract the tower with clouds of swarm missiles. If done correctly, it shouldn't be too expensive, but not every ship can carry and fire every missile/torpedo. It requires some preparation and will cost money.
5) Unusual tactics. Occupy the towers for around 10 minutes until your own Lasertowers are deployed. Given enough towers you shouldn't lose any of them.
6) Even more unusual tactics. Hire a TL and tell him to move to the Lasertower. Use the TL as shield so that the tower can't hit you. Once you are near enough, use something like a few Plasma Burst Generators to kill it off. It's risky since you have to go very near, but a PBG should destroy everything really fast. Or if you have too much money, deploy a cheap station as cover and use it to come near enough so that the tower won't be able to keep up with your speed.
7) Use missions. You could also wait until the station offers a Station Defence Mission, giving you free decoys. As you can communicate with it from 25km, it is a safe distance. ^^
Combine 5) and 6). Use the TL to go as near as 4km, tell him to stop while you deploy your towers and wait until they are ready. Then make a full speed retreat and tell the TL to move away. Your own Lasertowers would outgun any resistance. They aren't even that expensive, though ten of them are hard to get. 
1) Higher range. If the tower is using the Plasma Beam Cannon (5.85km) and given its shields, a Photon Pulse Cannon (6.62km) or Point Singularity Projector (6.42km) should work fine. Missiles have by far a greater range, but they can be shot down. The downside is how much money you have to invest in a ship able to carry this weapon and the weapon itself, costing 1 Mio each. The Xenon Q and the Boron Thresher are the only non-M1/M2 able to equip it. But you will keep all your investments, beyond buying it there won't be further costs.
2) High shields. Just shoot it down while having enough shields to take all the damage. I don't think anything lower than capital ships can manage that against three Lasertowers at once. But once you have one, you can as well go ahead and use 1). Expensive to buy, though. Usually an M7 should also work, but in DiD I wouldn't risk it. If anything goes wrong, you couldn't retreat fast enough.
3) Hard-to-hit Drones. Send something that is hard to hit while it does a constant stream of damage. A mix of Fighter Drones (MK1 + MK2, since MK1 is way faster) should be enough, but that takes time and there is still the risk of them getting shot down. You can help with Missiles or even use the drones as decoy while sending something really nasty, something like a Firestorm torpedo or two. That would also decimate your drones though. The costs are moderate I think, but you don't have to invest more than a million.
4) Missile spam. Fire a few heavy torpedos and distract the tower with clouds of swarm missiles. If done correctly, it shouldn't be too expensive, but not every ship can carry and fire every missile/torpedo. It requires some preparation and will cost money.
5) Unusual tactics. Occupy the towers for around 10 minutes until your own Lasertowers are deployed. Given enough towers you shouldn't lose any of them.
6) Even more unusual tactics. Hire a TL and tell him to move to the Lasertower. Use the TL as shield so that the tower can't hit you. Once you are near enough, use something like a few Plasma Burst Generators to kill it off. It's risky since you have to go very near, but a PBG should destroy everything really fast. Or if you have too much money, deploy a cheap station as cover and use it to come near enough so that the tower won't be able to keep up with your speed.
7) Use missions. You could also wait until the station offers a Station Defence Mission, giving you free decoys. As you can communicate with it from 25km, it is a safe distance. ^^
Combine 5) and 6). Use the TL to go as near as 4km, tell him to stop while you deploy your towers and wait until they are ready. Then make a full speed retreat and tell the TL to move away. Your own Lasertowers would outgun any resistance. They aren't even that expensive, though ten of them are hard to get. No strategy works quite so well as a Tiger with a Turbo Booster.
On the other hand a couple of Busters full of Wasps make a good distraction for a heavier missile. LT's aren't terribly agile so you can fire behind them as they try to shoot down the wasp swarm.
Or go steal an M7M and Flail them to death.
On the other hand a couple of Busters full of Wasps make a good distraction for a heavier missile. LT's aren't terribly agile so you can fire behind them as they try to shoot down the wasp swarm.
Or go steal an M7M and Flail them to death.
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APR Book 2: Best Served Cold Updated 8/5/2016
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You were obviously doing the Berryl 3 LT deploy mission, then this is AP correct?
In AP, you can just send in a ship within scanner range (but outside of the LTsweapon range, 7km I think), or just drop an adv nav sat, then jump out of the sector. The LTs will turn blue if you are in good relationship with their owner.
In AP, you can just send in a ship within scanner range (but outside of the LTsweapon range, 7km I think), or just drop an adv nav sat, then jump out of the sector. The LTs will turn blue if you are in good relationship with their owner.
Yes, that's the mission. I wasn't posting it due to possible spoilers. I should be quite friendly with the faction, assuming it's the Argon, since that's what it says. Apart from the Terrans, I've got extremely high relations with everyone except the Paranid. And I didn't do anything to upset the station that I know of... after all... it's the place I have to return all my quests for now.
But I have been within radar range and jumped a couple times now, and they're still red to me. I'm guessing it's a bug. I could try an advanced satellite to leave something else within radar range apart from me and see how that works. Up until now, I just flew in and jumped out really quickly taking heavy damage to my shields. But now that I have to deliver a ship there that's rather hard to get, I don't want to risk it with aggressive lasertowers.
EDIT: The satellite trick worked. Definitely something I'd classify as a known bug. Especially on... you know... the main mission of the expansion. But at least I can start searching for ships now.
But I have been within radar range and jumped a couple times now, and they're still red to me. I'm guessing it's a bug. I could try an advanced satellite to leave something else within radar range apart from me and see how that works. Up until now, I just flew in and jumped out really quickly taking heavy damage to my shields. But now that I have to deliver a ship there that's rather hard to get, I don't want to risk it with aggressive lasertowers.
EDIT: The satellite trick worked. Definitely something I'd classify as a known bug. Especially on... you know... the main mission of the expansion. But at least I can start searching for ships now.
No, you have to leave a ship or nav sat in-sectpr in radar range of the LTs, but yourself have to be Out-Of-Sector for the game engine to recalculate the FoF relationship.Arqane wrote:Yes, that's the mission. I wasn't posting it due to possible spoilers. I should be quite friendly with the faction, assuming it's the Argon, since that's what it says. Apart from the Terrans, I've got extremely high relations with everyone except the Paranid. And I didn't do anything to upset the station that I know of... after all... it's the place I have to return all my quests for now.
But I have been within radar range and jumped a couple times now, and they're still red to me. I'm guessing it's a bug. I could try an advanced satellite to leave something else within radar range apart from me and see how that works. Up until now, I just flew in and jumped out really quickly taking heavy damage to my shields. But now that I have to deliver a ship there that's rather hard to get, I don't want to risk it with aggressive lasertowers.
EDIT: The satellite trick worked. Definitely something I'd classify as a known bug. Especially on... you know... the main mission of the expansion. But at least I can start searching for ships now.
[EDIT] Glad it worked for you!!!