The no-lose method of acquiring skilled marines

Jimmy C · Post by **Jimmy C** » Thu, 18. Sep 14, 20:36

I've been looking into getting more marines in order to have enough reinforcements to capture Xenon large caps.
Buying them from production facilities cost credits, and they're usually in need of major training. Costing even more credits.
Capturing them from RRF ships usually results in dead marines, defeating the purpose of the boarding in the first place.

BUT mission spawned cap ships have a handful of skilled marines among a load of no-stars! It's perfect. Completing a mission earns you credits and recognition. Then you can sell the ship for even more credits. Most importantly, the skilled marines are good enough to use immediately without further training. It's a win-win situation for you!

In addition, my fight rank is high enough that these ships occasionally spawn with PALCs. So, not only have I gotten over 2 shiploads of skilled marines, I've been able to fully equip a Pteranodon with PALCs, all 28 slots! Now, I'm working on getting enough to reequip my Tiger and Panther.

I rely exclusively on M7Ms for boarding, so I usually end up throwing a lot of Flails and Hammers away. But selling the ships pays for them. Those who use lasers to aid boarding can get even more earnings than I do.

hisazul · Post by **hisazul** » Fri, 19. Sep 14, 03:42

Completely irrelevant to your topic but I always feel the need to say this.

Unless you install a fix for beam weapons(all aside from Kyons and repair laser) don't mount PALC into main guns... it does less damage then PAC when shot by player. AI will do proper damage with it just not you, instead of beam weapon it's rapid fire weapon with really really REALLY shiny and long projectiles. Use PPC in main guns, plus unlike PALC with PPC you can half kill Q before it enters "firing range" think at Pteranodons and Q's speed you can start shooting Q from about 8km. Anyway point is... don't mount PALC in main guns, even whey they work PPC fully charged is much more strategically sound option for main guns. Turrets... yeah PALC is beastly there as long as you aren't the one shooting its awesome.

Anyway Preranodon is beastly and the fact that both broadsides are so close to the nose they can shoot targets infront of you... and they get about 180 degree coverage for sides... just super sexy. And its tiny... fast... and with 30 fighter hangar capacity >_>

Jimmy C · Post by **Jimmy C** » Fri, 19. Sep 14, 04:22

The Pteranodon only has a 14 craft bay, not 30. And point taken about the main guns. Thanks.

hisazul · Post by **hisazul** » Fri, 19. Sep 14, 22:58

Jimmy C wrote:The Pteranodon only has a 14 craft bay, not 30. And point taken about the main guns. Thanks.

Oops not sure where that 30 came from you are correct, granted its 16 not 14 LOL

riceygringo · Post by **riceygringo** » Sat, 20. Sep 14, 05:15

Wait, how do you capture these marines? Wouldn't boarding kill them?

Jimmy C · Post by **Jimmy C** » Sat, 20. Sep 14, 07:03

The marines are ejected once your boarders reach the Core. They'll then begin making their way to the closest station. Arrange to pick them up with a TP. If you're flying an M6, consider scooping them up and dumping them in the TP yourself, the pathfinding AI leaves a lot to be desired if you're IS at the time. And you likely will be to sort out your newly acquired ship.
At least once, I saw a ship firing on its former marines, spoilsport!
To get the marines, it's best to lead the ship a long way away from any stations before they eject, to give yourself more time to pick them up.

Vim Razz · Post by **Vim Razz** » Sat, 20. Sep 14, 07:24

Just note that this only happens in AP. In TC, all defending marines will be killed (unless you're running a really, really old version of TC).

hisazul · Post by **hisazul** » Sat, 20. Sep 14, 17:52

Ehhh I thought they always died in TC since retail version. Unless it was pre-fps fix.

Jimmy C · Post by **Jimmy C** » Sat, 20. Sep 14, 18:07

Again I saw a ship firing on its former marines. I think I might have an idea of what's happening.
I think it's because the ship was the principal target of the assassination mission. Those ships have "attack all enemies" on them still on even after I capture them.

In my latest boarding, I was a little torn. I had to choose between one Frigate that had 3 PALCs, but only 1 good marine, or another that had 4 good marines, but no PALCs. I went for the PALCs, unfortunately, the good marine didn't make it.

hisazul · Post by **hisazul** » Sun, 21. Sep 14, 04:02

Jimmy C wrote:Again I saw a ship firing on its former marines. I think I might have an idea of what's happening.
I think it's because the ship was the principal target of the assassination mission. Those ships have "attack all enemies" on them still on even after I capture them.

In my latest boarding, I was a little torn. I had to choose between one Frigate that had 3 PALCs, but only 1 good marine, or another that had 4 good marines, but no PALCs. I went for the PALCs, unfortunately, the good marine didn't make it.

Thing is, each separate marine belongs to a race. So if lets say you are at war with Argon and have Argon marine, if you do space walk with him he will be >red< to you. He will function as normal but he will be red. So while mission ship could be pirates/yaki their marines aren't. So they will shoot them like any enemy.

Sometimes you can catch a personnel transporter docking at you PHQ with "your name" race. Those guys will be green since they share the "player" race. Just little funny thing on the side

Jimmy C · Post by **Jimmy C** » Thu, 6. Nov 14, 17:16

An update on my situation.
This method has been wildly successful. A little too successful perhaps. I now have about 160 maxed marines sitting in various ships and who knows how many more in training, with one maxing out every few minutes now. All of their training fully paid for by the sale of their ships.
I know some others have over a hundred marines too, where do you put all of them before you use them?
I suppose I should stop but I can't resist taking these combat missions. And when I scan the ships, all I can think of is, "those marines are mine, I just have to take them!"
What should I do?!

DrBullwinkle · Post by **DrBullwinkle** » Thu, 6. Nov 14, 19:42

Heh. Nice "problem" to have.

I keep trained marines on TPs. When I begin a particularly difficult boarding op, I jump the TP in to resupply my M7M (in case I need more than 20 marines for the op).

I have other uses for marines as well, so I also keep a few on each capital ship. But that's an S&M story.

Regarding PALCs, a Pteranodon can melt a Tyr in seconds when flown by the player. At very long range. They are not so underpowered in that role.

Jimmy C · Post by **Jimmy C** » Fri, 7. Nov 14, 02:15

DrBullwinkle wrote:Heh. Nice "problem" to have.

Isn't it just? And you know what? I came up with this by myself. Other posters have mentioned grabbing marines in the past, but I never saw anyone mention it could be used as the main source of marines before.
In the process, I've also learned more about mission spawned ships that I've ever read before.

I keep trained marines on TPs. When I begin a particularly difficult boarding op, I jump the TP in to resupply my M7M (in case I need more than 20 marines for the op).

I thought as much. But my question is where do you house the TPs? I'm running out of ports on my HQs already. I suppose I could just stuff them on any available complex. I have a few.

DrBullwinkle · Post by **DrBullwinkle** » Fri, 7. Nov 14, 02:19

Sure, any of your stations will do. Or just free floating in your well-protected home sector.

Until full of 4x100 "SEAL"s, I keep them parked at an Equipment Dock so that they can pick up marines as they finish training. Best to do that in a well-defended sector. Black Hole Sun is my favorite, but there are plenty of other safe EQDs.

DrBullwinkle · Post by **DrBullwinkle** » Fri, 7. Nov 14, 04:57

Oh, and I think that Advanced Complex Hub Mk2 (Zeron-mk7) and Advanced Complex Hub (Saetan) are "vanilla safe", as well.

Both add additional docking bays to your complex hubs. The Mk2 hub adds mooring points for capital ships, which allows for more docking points (without AI collisions). Looks more realistic, as well.

(If you care about your *modified* flag, then check it before saving. Just to be sure.)

Jimmy C · Post by **Jimmy C** » Fri, 14. Nov 14, 07:21

I'm doing a preemptive inquiry. I can see that mission-spawned ships can have more skilled marines on higher fight ranks. It used to be just four on Battlemaster, but Conqueror can have up to eight on a single ship.
What I would like to know is, at even higher ranks, can the ship be completely filled by skilled marines? That would make it as tough as an RRF ship for boarding. At which point, it would no longer be worthwhile to focus on these ships for their marines.

DrBullwinkle · Post by **DrBullwinkle** » Fri, 14. Nov 14, 07:31

I don't think they are ever completely filled with highly trained marines.

I have seen them with maybe 16 marines of various skill levels. Approximately.

By the time you get to that level, your own teams should be strong enough to take them.

Jimmy C · Post by **Jimmy C** » Fri, 14. Nov 14, 08:19

If I were using the maxed marines, sure.
But the way I go about it is, I use the "recruited" marines to capture ships for more marines until they hit 100 Fight. Then, I send them to training until they max out. They are replaced by newer recruited marines.
So my boarding team is usually between 3 and 5 star in fighting ability.

DrBullwinkle · Post by **DrBullwinkle** » Fri, 14. Nov 14, 08:20

Adapt or perish, Jimmy.

Same rules for everyone. It has always been that way.

Seriously, though, all you have to do is have a stronger team than the enemy has. You can usually do that with a mix of trained and untrained marines.

Jimmy C · Post by **Jimmy C** » Fri, 14. Nov 14, 09:08

I hope 10 maxed marines supporting them will be good enough. I'll keep this in mind when I get higher up on fight rank.

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The no-lose method of acquiring skilled marines

The no-lose method of acquiring skilled marines

Re: The no-lose method of acquiring skilled marines