Pirate stations in unknown sector PTNI

[AL'42]

Well I thought the unknown sector next to PTNI would be a safe haven for training my marines, 3 pirate stations there, well off the beaten track, far away from the gate, Teladi space all around. To my great surprise 4 game days in, a Split Tiger and large fighter support entered the sector and made a direct beeline for the pirate stations, no messing about, no wandering around first, like they knew exactly where their target was!!

I’m wondering how this is possible, is it programmed into the game to have the pirate stations attacked periodically no matter where they are, in other words the Split had it in their database right from game start where the pirates were or do the scouts actually do real scouting and report back ?

Somewhere like Loomankstrats I expected it and had ships stationed there waiting for the attack message which did come eventually, again 4 days in, no big surprise there considering the huge build up of Boron warships in the sector. Now I’m wondering if I’m safe holed up in Freedom’s Reach with my fleet? There’s loads of traffic to the Teladi Trading Station there, God knows what business they’re all doing, but so far no military ships.

(X3TC pirate)

[Alan Phipps]

Just a vague theory or two while somebody with the skills hopefully checks the code.

It is possible that a Split task force was spawned with a patrol to sector ... job. Not sure though.

Alternatively, if the Split had had any assets (traders, other civilian or recce ships say) attacked by the station fixed defences or local ships and those were strongly associated with one or more of the pirate bases or their general location, then a task force could be sent to deal with the attackers.

I suppose the response could even be triggered if a Split ship accidentally collided with a pirate base while you were IS.

[AL'42]

Jf the Split had had any assets (traders, other civilian or recce ships say) attacked by the station fixed defences

Now that’s a very interesting theory, that the pirate stations mostly get attacked because they’re laser towers have attacked a race ship. That would make a lot of sense. I wonder if its true? If so, time to remove those laser towers!

Maybe that’s what happened at Loomankstrats, a passing Boron M6 patrol got attacked by the station defenses and then the whole sector suddenly woke up with every Boron warship in the area making its way over to investigate. (I was ready that time).

[RAVEN.myst]

Just some observations from my play time:

The pirate base in the particular sector that you (the OP) originally referred to almost always gets hit at some point - I've almost never seen that base survive late into a game (though it has happened once or twice). It seems that no pirate base is ever truly safe from eventual extinction, though sometimes (quite rarely) one will survive apparently indefinitely (and sometimes it's particularly strange, as it might be a more "exposed" and visible station, nearer to mainstream traffic.) Maybe they have some sort of randomised variable that is set at station creation time, which determines the odds of it being targeted, but that is pure speculation on my part.

One of the gurus recently mentioned to me that from time to time, a race's military will generate a "search and destroy" task targeting a nearby pirate base. I have no idea what the parameters may be - what is the frequency, is it a periodic probability-based check, if so what is the probability, what is the effective range of the strike, what is the strike team's home base, etc.

I'm not sure what you mean when you ask whether you're safe in Freedom's Reach - is there a pirate base there in your game at the moment, at which you are training marines? If so, the chances of it being attacked are as discussed above - ie. I have no real idea. However, if you mean whether your fleet is safe from an "anti-pirate police initiative", then you are - no matter what your actions in-game, you are not considered a member of any particular faction by NPCs (possibly this can be modified by actual modding of the game, but I wouldn't know about that), so no matter what your relations with the local races, you wouldn't be seen as "pirate" by them (and thus, you wouldn't be specifically targeted.) However, if you are hostile to a race, hanging around a pirate base, and that hostile race happens to send a task force at that base, then yes, you would end up in a firefight, of course, by dint of "wrong place at wrong time".

I wish my incoherent ramblings could be of more help

[AL'42]

I only lost 5 marines at PTNI, 18 made it to 3* training (before the attack on the pirate station) and are now on active duty, so not the disaster it could have been.

Yes, there’s a pirate base in Freedoms Reach, no training though. I guess part of the problem is getting the military to attack one of your assets first so you get the attack warning. ‘defend position’ would be great if it wasn’t for ‘red’ pirate ships and traders just visiting as I don’t want them attacked (my rep with pirates is high, everyone else rock bottom). At PTNI I did have a navsat by the gate and a fighter mid sector, both got ignored, obviously that Split patrol had strict orders to destroy the pirate stations only, no deviation allowed.

[RAVEN.myst]

If you want to use a defend command and don't want any pirates, even red ones, attacked (they ARE your friends, after all...heheh), you could try disabling "set to enemy if enemy to me" and leave pirates as friend, for whichever ships you want to use (or all of them) - this will ignore red pirates even if they are shooting at you, so there is a potential drawback, therefore use with care.

[Nanook]

RAVEN.myst has it mostly correct. Each race can randomly generate task forces with assigned targets. Those targets can be any enemy installation. Most of the pirate bases and stations throughout the game are subject to these attacks, depending on the RNG. They'll even generate attacks on their racial enemies, such as Paranid task forces attacking Home of Light or Argons TF's attacking Paranid Prime, for example. Split and Boron do the same.

As for the scouts, yes, they do spy out targets for their races' militaries. And if you're an enemy of one of those races, beware of their scouts finding your assets to attack.

[RAVEN.myst]

Each race can randomly generate task forces with assigned targets. Those targets can be any enemy installation. Most of the pirate bases and stations throughout the game are subject to these attacks, depending on the RNG. They'll even generate attacks on their racial enemies, such as Paranid task forces attacking Home of Light or Argons TF's attacking Paranid Prime, for example. Split and Boron do the same.

As for the scouts, yes, they do spy out targets for their races' militaries. And if you're an enemy of one of those races, beware of their scouts finding your assets to attack.

Thanks, good info - and that last bit is particularly interesting, that races CAN specifically target the player's toys. Good to know! (And I like it that way - makes it a bit more "realistic", visceral, and challenging, all things I appreciate.) I've never been targeted in this manner, but I'll make sure to give enemies more reason to - maybe next time I antagonise a race I'll build on its doorstep, instead of far away

[Nanook]

I think you have to be at or near the bottom of your relations with a race to make it target you. I think you also generally need a significant number of stations compared to the total of all the NPC stations to get the RNG on your side in this matter. It's been quite a while, but I think the only time I was actively targeted was in a game where I tried to put at least one station in every sector of the five main races. I had close to 200 stations total. Of course, it didn't do much for my fps.

[Timsup2nothin]

Having played as an irredeemable enemy to a specific race a fair number of times I have been on the receiving end of a race task force attack a few times. It does make things interesting.

[RAVEN.myst]

Excellent! I always make sure to have at least one mortal enemy (boring, otherwise - done universal love&trade playthroughs before, but they get dull eventually, I find), but from now on I'll push the envelope with the intention to "receive guests"

[Timsup2nothin]

Excellent! I always make sure to have at least one mortal enemy (boring, otherwise - done universal love&trade playthroughs before, but they get dull eventually, I find), but from now on I'll push the envelope with the intention to "receive guests"

Just by observation you have to be well past "shoot on sight" status. I've played games where I literally never did a mission for a Paranid and attacked every Paranid ship I saw in Argon or neutral space, and when I had the capacity I went after them in their own sectors. Those games seem to have led to them coming after me at some point pretty much every time, though it has taken quite a while sometimes.

Building in sectors they tend to invade anyway seems to encourage them. I would say I've had the most task force battles in Red Light, though I haven't kept a record or anything and my tendency towards building in Red Light probably has something to do with that.

[jlehtone]

Oh my,


I'm currently "T. Terrorist 9%". Rank -4 isn't it? At the lower end of the -100k -- -10k range. That is still far from minus million points. No task forces detected yet.

(I'm particularly fond of the Terran captains that praise my flying skills. They must have heard that killing competition with Large Asteroids was a lucrative Sport among Community of planets some decades ago.)

I have station next door to Heretic's End (which in X3 AP has war action). The only red thing that I have noticed at my doorstep was a Terran trader convoy and all four freighters were Commonwealth designs. RNG jobs.


X3 TC, East from PTNI. Pirate Bases, Barracks and flamethrowers? One of them is involved in some plot. Plots infer some invulnerability. However, that does not help the others. Could make it worse; invulnerable enemy is a tarpit for AI.


There is almost a question though. The Pirate Bases relocate on destruction (respawn after delay in random sector). That game mechanics is older than the X3 serie. The Anarchy Port, like Shipyards, EQ Docks and Trade Stations does not relocate.

I have not paid attention, but I have assumed that the Barracks and "Military" are similar to governmental installations that stick to/respawn in same spot.

The NPC Factories come and go, not just because we shoot at them, but as GoD events too. Again, they don't really move; they are "on" or "off", just more often than the govenrment.

Am I right that the Pirate Bases remain the only "mobile" and all other stations owned by Pirates are simply on|off?

[RAVEN.myst]

(I'm particularly fond of the Terran captains that praise my flying skills.

Hehehe - yeah, every time I hear that one I think to myself "Oh yeah? How healthy would it be to fly into a large asteroid? It's the same here, sunshine! "

The only red thing that I have noticed at my doorstep was a Terran trader convoy and all four freighters were Commonwealth designs. RNG jobs.

Btw and FYI, as far as I can tell, those Terran convoys made up of CW freighters are always the targets of a convoy-killing mission to be found nearby (I could be wrong, but I've always seen the above to be the case), rather than simple RNG.

I have not paid attention, but I have assumed that the Barracks and "Military" are similar to governmental installations that stick to/respawn in same spot.

In X3AP, that's right, but in X3TC once they're dead (including by GoD action) they stay dead - this has been a source of huge annoyance for me in games, as I always choose a race (based on game-start scenario, of course), and use only ships, stations, and marines of that race. In AP it was fixed, so those stations are at the very least GoD-proof (and, I *think*, also respawn in time if killed, but not sure about this last bit).

Am I right that the Pirate Bases remain the only "mobile" and all other stations owned by Pirates are simply on|off?

As far as I can tell, yes you are correct in that supposition. GoD activity can cause stations such as mines and SPPs to disappear and seem to reappear somewhere else, but it is in fact a different station being "turned on" (a good example is Emperor Mines in the early game, before the player cranks up the demand for ore - various ore mines blink off and on during that period, with the "shape" of the sector changing frequently in that time.)

[Timsup2nothin]

Oh my,


I'm currently "T. Terrorist 9%". Rank -4 isn't it? At the lower end of the -100k -- -10k range. That is still far from minus million points. No task forces detected yet.

Yet another demonstration that there are no problems in the universe that cannot be solved by application of sufficient numbers of tomahawk missiles. A couple passes through Paranid space in a bomber reducing their stations to scattered debris will move you a good distance towards that negative million.