Is my router dying?

[greypanther]

Or is it that my ISP, ( BT, ) are just getting worse?

I am having to reset the router pretty much daily now and my ip address changes constantly. The last speed check I used, ( OOKLA, ) inferred that I am living in London for goodness sake! I am in fact in Cheshire!

I have had problems with BT for ages now and am not sure why I am still with them, perhaps because other options are no better it seems. The infrastructure hereabouts needs work.

I live less than two miles from the exchange, yet feel myself lucky to get 3.2 speed. Last night it was so slow, the speed check page would not load, even this website struggled, it is sometimes like being on dial up! The lowest I have registered in the past is 0.7. It was 2.7 just a moment ago, not sure how long that will last as I am still living in London it seems!

So could it be the router that is failing? or is BT getting worse? Either way I need to get shouty with BT, either for a new router, or to tell them to do one and go for Virgin. So which is it, please...

[InFlamesForEver]

I literally moved out of my parents house to get better internet. I don't know how you can survive on 3 meg nowadays with huge games, and streaming. Personally I'd go with virgin just to get a decent speed.

[euclid]

BT and me, we have a history

Ever been with BT, from ISDN via ADSL to fiber connection (Infinity) and there was trouble in the past. I had to go via Oftel to sort things out. But that's a long time ago.

However, since I've switched to fiber I get a connection lost for a few seconds every now and then, usually in the evening hours. With ADSL I had a business contract to ensure that the congestion rate is low but now, with Infinity, the technicians either do not know or refuse to tell me the congestion rate (" .. there is none").

So, to cut a long story short, I suspect you router is the problem. But it might be an issue with the local exchange in which case your neighbors should have trouble. too (talk to them?).

And if BT refuses to look into the matter, don't be shy to contact Oftel. It worked for me

Cheers Euclid

[Redvers Ganderpoke]

I'm in the land of the grinning cat as well and with EE (which is has been bought by BT ) and on FTTC - I don't use any of EEs kit as frankly it was rubbish and from what I've seen of BT's stuff it isn't much better. It shouldn't cost too much to get a 3rd party replacement router ( I use a router in modem mode (TP-Link TD-W9970 ~£30) and connect through a Sophos UTM) to see it it fixes the problem.

I had similar problems with slow speeds and od drop outs which was done to the modem failing - looked fine but just became flaky.

[pjknibbs]

If Speedtest is telling you that you're connected to somewhere down London way then I would be inclined to blame the routing the ISP is doing, not the routing that your router is doing...if you see what I mean. This is especially true if that doesn't change after rebooting the router.

The real problem, of course, would be getting BT to admit to that. Chances are they won't believe it's a problem at their end until you've replaced every single bit of connection kit inside your house, including the router.

[felter]

Are you using a VPN, that would make you appear somewhere you are not when using OOKLA. What BT box are you using, as their different router/modems have different problems. Also try the BT forums, as there is some knowledgeable people on there that may be able to help you, even more than what BT's own customer support can.

I used to be with BT, had been from way back, but I left them a year and a half ago as they have turned into a corporate piece of crap that doesn't give a toss about their customers. Where the left hand doesn't even know what the right is doing. Hell I even had an argument with one of their customer support people, as she didn't know what a telephone pole was, or what it was used for, and I'm not making that up.

[CBJ]

I had similar problems a few years back. Speed was poor considering the distance (about 1 mile in my case) and the connection kept dropping; call quality on phone calls was also pretty poor. After many months, numerous phone calls of the "have you tried turning it off and on again" variety, and several engineer visits, BT finally worked out that my physical connection was plugged into a dodgy comms card at the exchange end. They replaced the card and everything magically got much better. I'd long since worked out the problem was at the exchange end, as had at least one of the engineers who paid me a visit, but of course the call centres have to go through the proper process in the correct sequence regardless. On the plus side, when they finally admitted they'd messed up, I did get a partial refund on my next bill.

[pjknibbs]

I used to be with BT, had been from way back, but I left them a year and a half ago as they have turned into a corporate piece of crap that doesn't give a toss about their customers.

Turned into? Pretty sure they've been that way since 1980--and the only reason they weren't like that before then was because they didn't exist!

[Stars_InTheirEyes]

Which? surveyed 1,800 people about their broadband in November and December. The customer score was based on satisfaction levels with their provider and whether they would recommend it to others.

TalkTalk and BT achieved the worst scores, with 38% and 45% respectively, with just one in 10 of their customers describing their service as excellent. BT did not score more than two stars in any of the categories and TalkTalk only achieved more than two in one area – value for money.

EE and the Post Office each managed 48%, while Sky and Virgin scored 49% and 52% respectively.

Zen topped the table with 86%, followed by Utility Warehouse on 81%. John Lewis came in third on 68% followed by SSE on 66% and the BT-owned Plusnet on 65%.

Just four providers scored more than three stars for speed – Zen, Utility Warehouse, Virgin Media and Vodafone.

I've just ordered a new router/modem to replace our BT Home Hub 5. Would change provider but since no bugger wants to make the 100 metre connection from the exchange to our cul de sac we're unlikely get fibre or much improved speeds regardless of who we're with.

[red assassin]

IP geolocation is notoriously inaccurate. You can't really infer anything of value from it coming up with a slightly incorrect value, especially as London is as likely to mean "somewhere in the UK, we don't know where so we picked the biggest city" rather than a specific London location to a typical geolocation service.

[greypanther]

Edit: thanks for all the answers and advice, it is all welcome and helpful and has helped to come to a conclusion or two.

I have just checked our current speed, the router has reset itself, it is now 0.67. At least we are showing up as living in Liverpool, which is a little closer I guess.

I literally moved out of my parents house to get better internet. I don't know how you can survive on 3 meg nowadays with huge games, and streaming. Personally I'd go with virgin just to get a decent speed.

I know and am considering Virgin, but I was with them back in Blackpool, until things started to go wrong, when I discovered that their customer service and tech support was terrible. Only Talk Talk has been worse.

Added to which they have only just connected our home to their cable network, even though their box is 50 yards from our front door. For most of the last ten years, THEY told us we were already connected when plainly we have not been, they seem clueless to be honest. They are also not very tidy. They made a complete mess laying the cable and I fear what they will do to our actual garden!

My problem started when BT first made infinity available around here, which is when my service got slower ( -25%? ) and much less reliable, sometimes cutting out altogether. Bts tech support is as crap as the rest, imo, did not really help much. Though threatening to leave improved things for a while. This has happened several times and seems a crap way to run a company. It did seem to be sorting it as soon as I did the hard reset for quite a while, but the problem has now become worse and I am having to reset most days now.

I have spoken to an Open Reach engineer and he was helpful and seemingly honest. He claimed that, ( off the record, ) the infrastructure around here is in very great need of updating and expanding. It seems BT has been expanding its customer base, without expanding the network, things are just overloaded and old. Thing is, it seems that the service is unreliable for most around here, All seem to have problems with lack of speed, so what difference?

Virgin it seems is the exception, but they do have problems with their network too, with someone saying they are getting fed up of losing connection and calling out an engineer. I honestly do not know what to do really, perhaps concentrate on getting good customer service. There is not much difference between ISPs it seems to me.

No felter I am not using a VPN.

I am thinking that there is an obvious problem at the BT end and now the problems are compounded bu the Router maybe failing. Possible? I will phone BT tomorrow and see if they will send out a new router, but I think I will have to change ISP soon and that will be just a stop gap. Thank you for the customer scores Stars, it is useful.

Edit: No it is in fact not usually London, but moves around England, very often in the Midlands, particularly Wolverhampton, but has been the Portsmouth area as well as Newcastle and many more in Cheshire and Lancashire.

[CBJ]

If the problem you're having is anything like the one I had then changing ISPs won't necessarily help. It would only solve the problem if your ISP definitely has its own hardware at the exchange that they will physically reconnect you to, or uses a different physical medium such as cable.

[felter]

I actually didn't think you were on a VPN, but you know, if you don't ask it normally turns out that is the problem

As for asking BT for a new router, I don't know this for sure, but I'm going to take a guess that they will either offer to sell you a new one, or tell you that if they send you a new one, you will need to agree to a new 1 year (minimum) contract, they probably will not offer you it for free. If they will not send you a new for free tell them to get stuffed and buy yourself a better one with a third party name to it not a BT one. Also don't skimp on the cash when buying one, and do some homework before buying, as you get what you pay for and the cheap ones are not very secure.

I will also take a guess that you are using the Home Hub 5 as it seems that the HH5 has a problem with it resetting and disconnecting itself.

[greypanther]

Thanks for the extra answers guys.

In fact it is a home hub 4, type A, I just looked, should have done that at first. The last time I set up my own router was ages ago and I am not sure how to any more, I guess I will have to google it. BTs one is just plug and play, so to speak. I am not going to sign up for another year I think, unless I go for Infinity.

To be honest CBJ, after listening to the advice here and speaking to neighbours, that is my conclusion too. Either stay with BT and make it work, or change to Virgin, with all the other potential problems. It seems to be a no win situation.

I might write to my MP after June 8th, see how useful he is.

[Morkonan]

Or is it that my ISP, ( BT, ) are just getting worse?

...

So could it be the router that is failing? or is BT getting worse? Either way I need to get shouty with BT, either for a new router, or to tell them to do one and go for Virgin. So which is it, please...

Your issue is most likely your ISP. It could be anything from purposeful rebalancing to issues with a specific DNS server to internal network problems.

Your router has nothing to do with your IP address - That is assigned to you by your provider. It can, however, be forced to do certain things, depending upon whether or not you have been assigned a static IP or not. But, most providers do not assign static IP addresses because that requires them to do special things and they'd rather be able to reassign IPs on the fly, as necessary.

The IP address reported to any particular web page does not necessarily have to reflect your true IP address. (Though, strictly with full IP addys, the addy itself is usually true unless it is part of a VPN or other network you're connected to as an end-point.)

Your location data has nothing to do with your router, but it simply the location of record to whom the block of IP addys that your particular address is assigned to and/or the gateway you're currently assigned to to get from your ISP's network to the 'net. So, for instance, if the hub of your ISP's network that controls the particular block of the IP range that your IP is contained within, then that's what will come up when whatever page you're getting the report from displays "your location." This can change, as well, from time to time and there are different methods these pages use to get their reports. (One page can be much more accurate than another, going all the way down to the exchange down the street from you.)

Speed/network congestion - Could be your router or, considering the various changes you've detected in reporting and such, is more likely an ISP issue. Don't forget the recent hubbub and scrambles various institutions have been going through this week. Someone may have made a decision or some critical network may have had to have been taken down, ya never know.

My advice -

1) Hard reboot your router/modem (I assume it's combo unit, but have no idea how British stuffs and ISPs work.) by unplugging it for 15 minutes. Better yet, if you can leave it unplugged overnight, that might help it to get reassigned.

2) If that doesn't work at all, then see if you can get your ISP to "reprovision" your modem. Sometimes, this request can be an automated process, either through you accessing your account online and choosing "troubleshooting" options or by your making a phonecall and using a telephone menu system. If neither, then you'll have to actually talk to tech support to get this service. In general, it usually only take a few minutes for reprovisioning, where you get assigned a new IP addy and all the internal network stuffs get resorted out, but it can take up to 24hrs in the most extreme cases. (Usually only with a new customer and only with crappy/weird ISPs.)

3) If you still have issues, you can try assigning a static DNS server address or range of addresses in order to attempt to avoid a slowly reporting DNS server or a path to that server your ISP is having trouble with. (This is done by forcing your modem to only recognize/look for certain DNS servers, not the ones its usually fed by your ISP.) This is a more techie sort of thing and not generally fooled with, but you can ask your tech support to walk you through it if they're willing and if they know which DNS servers are causing issues for you. (They might not be readily willing to admit that - Sweet talk them.)

4) Or, a squirrel snacked on your cabling for lunch and you're screwed until that cabling is repaired. Someone could have also wrecked their car into your local gang-box, forcing the ISP to jump through hoops. Or, maybe a tech spilled their tea into the switches at the local hub? In any event, it's down to either you crawling around your house to see where the cabling is bad or calling a tech to do it for you, just to be sure.

5) Or, your ISP is going through problems and you're screwed until they figure everything out, no matter what you attempt to do on your end.

[Chips]

I once had really weird results with speed tests, it was all over the place but always shocking.

In the end after using Virgin's forums to talk with an admin, they did a load of diagnostics. It sounded like balderdash - they said it was synching to a higher speed than could be kept stable, then automatically dropping the speed down until it was stable. Basically it was constantly going down to <1mb.

They limited my line to 7.5Mb down speed, and it was rock steady ever since.

That was... about 8 years ago who knows.

[korio]

My company recently changed to BT as network and Phone provider....


All i can say it's that they s*ck, the deployment was a nightmare, the support is a nightmare and doing even the most inocuous and little change you can imagine involves 3+ mails at support and a ton of information requests.

Regarding your connection issue, here in Spain we have a law that forces the internet providers to give you atleast one % (cant remember the exact number) of the conection you have paid for, dont know if you have any law like this one to force them to fix your issues.

Overall, dealing with inet providers it's a nightmare, so i hope you can fix it soon.

[CBJ]

In the end after using Virgin's forums to talk with an admin, they did a load of diagnostics. It sounded like balderdash - they said it was synching to a higher speed than could be kept stable, then automatically dropping the speed down until it was stable. Basically it was constantly going down to <1mb.

That's actually exactly what happens. Through various conversations with engineers when I was having problems, they described the very much the same process. The noise on the line caused by the faulty card at the exchange end meant the router tried lower and lower speeds in an attempt to get a stable connection, and then eventually restarted the connection when even that failed. In your case I guess limiting the initial speed meant it didn't have to go through the process of finding a stable speed every time.

[Morkonan]

I've had the same overdrive speed issues, where the modem keeps cycling, dropping, ramping up, like a police scanner looking for a signal somewhere.

In my case, there were two culprits. One was the internal wiring, which I ripped out and replaced. That "seemed" to fix the issue for awhile. But, then the board at the local street/block box got fried/wet/damaged and it started all over again. They came out and replaced parts in that box, but never replaced the whole thing. Periodically, they had to keep coming out and replacing boards as they all would develop faults about every six months or so.

They'd rather spend $100 twice a year, forever, and listen to customers complain, than spend $500 every five years and provide rock-solid connections through that street gang-box...

[UniTrader]

They'd rather spend $100 twice a year, forever, and listen to customers complain, than spend $500 every five years and provide rock-solid connections through that street gang-box...

We have a nice saying for that here in Germany:
Sparen, koste es was es wolle
which roughly translates to:
save money, no matter the cost

also you may have the prices wrong.. could also be that the small replacement part costs 500 and replacing the thing as whole is about 10K, if not far more..