Star Trek - Discovery

Jericho · Post by **Jericho** » Mon, 30. Oct 17, 11:09

mrbadger wrote:Khan had a good bit more going on in the books than was ever covered on the TV, that might be material they could cover.

Only it didn't as a rule involve space battles, plus Khan was *mostly* a good guy,

Hmmm, I've read some crappy Trek books, and when it talks about young Khan, he was a proper little git... I guess if a book focuses on him, then it has to paint him a bit more sympathetic, otherwise it would just be an endless dull stream of murder and conquest.

One of the mirror-universe books in the seemingly never-ending series that Shatner adds his name to without ever seeing them, has Julian Bashir as one of Khan's disciples (Well, a holographic simulation of Khan obviously), and he rules with an iron fist. I can't remember the details, but he eventually sees the real older Khan's images, and is less than impressed with the truth than the brainwashing legacy.

Morkonan · Post by **Morkonan** » Mon, 30. Oct 17, 11:37

AFAIK, while Khan was certainly painted as a somewhat sympathetic figure, he did happen to emerge as the major antagonist during the "Eugenics Wars." Khan was a Ubermenschen/Nazi/Hitler figure... All he wanted was for his genetically engineered humans to rule over the inferior races, so I guess that's now being forgotten because it wasn't such a big deal?

I didn't read any of the fiction, just the adaptions of the series and then the "historic" documents. (Starfleet Manual, etc..) So, if they've greatly embellished that period of history, which was only loosely mentioned anyway, then I wouldn't know.

Usenko · Post by **Usenko** » Mon, 30. Oct 17, 13:03

Tonight's Disco was pretty great. I loved it. No guarantee that everyone else will like it, of course, but this is the first episode that really captured the "Must keep watching this!!!" buzz I used to get when watching TNG for the first time.

mrbadger · Post by **mrbadger** » Mon, 30. Oct 17, 13:20

It seems like it'll be ages till season one will be done being broadcast, even though there aren't many episodes in it.

Once it is I'll watch it.

I mean, it's Star Trek, there's no way it wouldn't get renewed for a second or third season at least.

At least it sounds like it's improving.

Usenko · Post by **Usenko** » Mon, 30. Oct 17, 14:11

Yes, already renewed for the second season.

Morkonan · Post by **Morkonan** » Mon, 30. Oct 17, 17:31

There's no way it wouldn't get renewed for at least another season. Surely, it would get renewed until there's another Star Trek IP that makes it to the wild.

It's not because of it's quality, though. It's because if it failed so quickly, it'd be a huge problem for Paramount. (Or, whoever owns the IP now) The stain of a big failure like that would spread to movie releases and any other ST IP they had in the works. Nobody loves a losing team...

They'd throw piles of money at keeping that thing on the air for a respectable run, at least until they had something up that could carry the torch.

Redvers Ganderpoke · Post by **Redvers Ganderpoke** » Mon, 30. Oct 17, 18:26

Usenko wrote:Tonight's Disco was pretty great. I loved it. No guarantee that everyone else will like it, of course, but this is the first episode that really captured the "Must keep watching this!!!" buzz I used to get when watching TNG for the first time.

I'll give you my verdict tomorrow

If I can persuade the wife to watch it as I'll watch any old rubbish, where as she has a bit more taste!

Golden_Gonads · Post by **Golden_Gonads** » Mon, 30. Oct 17, 22:29

Morkonan wrote:They'd throw piles of money at keeping that thing on the air for a respectable run, at least until they had something up that could carry the torch.

Most the cost was in the sets and other setup, so a future season will cost relatively little compared to the first.

Morkonan · Post by **Morkonan** » Tue, 31. Oct 17, 01:45

Golden_Gonads wrote:
Morkonan wrote:They'd throw piles of money at keeping that thing on the air for a respectable run, at least until they had something up that could carry the torch.
Most the cost was in the sets and other setup, so a future season will cost relatively little compared to the first.

Well, I'm sure the up-front costs of such a production are pretty darn big. But, a "million dollars per episode" budget, like TNG had, could be translated into today's bucks as "pretty darn expensive", still.

I think any production company would willingly throw money at this thing for a bit, even with bad reviews, just to gamble whether or not things would improve or they could successfully transfer the torch to another, more successful (or at least distracting) other work in the same IP.

pjknibbs · Post by **pjknibbs** » Tue, 31. Oct 17, 03:19

You have touching faith in production companies, in that case. We live in a world where Firefly didn't make it through more than half a season, after all. Since Discovery is on Netflix I guess it doesn't have to go through pickups halfway through the season like most US shows, so at least they'll finish the first season!

Usenko · Post by **Usenko** » Tue, 31. Oct 17, 08:04

Whether the press is good or bad, Disco is rating pretty heavily at the moment. Any production company would have to be insane not to renew it.

Jericho · Post by **Jericho** » Tue, 31. Oct 17, 10:43

Usenko wrote:Tonight's Disco was pretty great. I loved it. No guarantee that everyone else will like it, of course, but this is the first episode that really captured the "Must keep watching this!!!" buzz I used to get when watching TNG for the first time.

I need more sleep... I thought the episode was called "Tonight's Disco"...

I now realize you meant "Tonight's episode of Discovery..."

I thought they went to a club or something...

Out of interest, how does this show handle crowds? I always hated on TNG where they go to a new world and meet the entire population of the city... 12 extras.

At least DS9 usually had a fair few people on the Promenade... (Apparently the DS9 sets were actually really small, and built to a slightly smaller scale, and then they used different camera lenses to make it look bigger than it really is... But I guess that is somewhat common with TV shows. I wonder how they would have coped with widescreen, and would they use the same techniques?)

Usenko · Post by **Usenko** » Tue, 31. Oct 17, 13:09

Jericho wrote:
Usenko wrote: I thought they went to a club or something...

Out of interest, how does this show handle crowds? I always hated on TNG where they go to a new world and meet the entire population of the city... 12 extras.

The issue is yet to really arise. So far the only large crowd scene was in tonight's episode, and THAT was a party aboard the ship, in the Rec room; so it only really showed whichever crew members happened to be off duty at that particular time, which would have been maybe 20-40.

And incidentally, it DID look like they were at a club.

At least DS9 usually had a fair few people on the Promenade... (Apparently the DS9 sets were actually really small, and built to a slightly smaller scale, and then they used different camera lenses to make it look bigger than it really is... But I guess that is somewhat common with TV shows. I wonder how they would have coped with widescreen, and would they use the same techniques?)
There are basically three problems with this sort of thing:

1) Budget.

2) Budget.

3) Budget.

Redvers Ganderpoke · Post by **Redvers Ganderpoke** » Tue, 31. Oct 17, 13:10

Well, my verdict is in - the wife left the room - I carried on for a bit. The episode was a bit clichéd to say the least. I will not spoil it for others but it didn't do a lot for me as it just rehashed lots of other old sci-fi plots.

Who the hell is HFM as he isn't the same character that appears in TOS. (See I,Mudd and Mudd's Women)

mrbadger · Post by **mrbadger** » Tue, 31. Oct 17, 15:41

Watched Episode one of Orville last night, breaking my rule of not watching something while its in the first season, because I was bored.

Change the uniforms, and it could have been a pretty darned good 'funny Star Trek', I enjoyed the whole thing.

Morkonan · Post by **Morkonan** » Tue, 31. Oct 17, 17:53

pjknibbs wrote:You have touching faith in production companies, in that case. We live in a world where Firefly didn't make it through more than half a season, after all. Since Discovery is on Netflix I guess it doesn't have to go through pickups halfway through the season like most US shows, so at least they'll finish the first season!

I understand. But, I don't really see the appeal that Firefly's enthusiastic fanbase draws on, to be honest. Sure, it was probably more interesting than some other sci-fi shows that were more successful. It certainly had an interesting setting, so I'll give it that much. And, it had a sort of wild-west-in-space kinda appeal, I suppose.

Still... From what I saw of it, it was only "OK." That being said, I don't begrudge anyone their enthusiasms, especially when it comes down to science-fiction.

But, if this holds any truths, it does demonstrate that Firefly was not an established, billions-of-dollars, IP that would have warranted the sorts of protections I've put forth: http://www.looper.com/10800/real-reason ... -canceled/

IOW - It had more problems than it had any right to have. Things were far from perfect for that series. Linear storylines aired out of order? Lolz... GG, way to win teh game...

Usenko · Post by **Usenko** » Thu, 2. Nov 17, 12:13

Redvers Ganderpoke wrote: Who the hell is HFM as he isn't the same character that appears in TOS. (See I,Mudd and Mudd's Women)

Oh, he's the same character, in much the same way that Batman (a la Chris Nolan) is the same character as the Batman of the 1960s TV show . . .

burger1 · Post by **burger1** » Thu, 2. Nov 17, 19:01

mrbadger wrote:Watched Episode one of Orville last night, breaking my rule of not watching something while its in the first season, because I was bored.

Change the uniforms, and it could have been a pretty darned good 'funny Star Trek', I enjoyed the whole thing.

The Orville has also been renewed for a second season. Orville has only 13 episodes while Discovery has 15-16 episodes in season 1.

https://deadline.com/2017/11/the-orvill ... 202200369/

Jericho · Post by **Jericho** » Fri, 3. Nov 17, 08:59

I've not seen The Orville yet, but I've watched a few clips on youtube...

I really don't like the way their voices echo across the bridge.. Almost as if it were a school play. They need to fire their sound-guys, and maybe use a boom instead of whatever crappy mic is attached to the camcorder... (I jest...). It just screams 'Amateur' but not in an intentional or funny way.

Redvers Ganderpoke · Post by **Redvers Ganderpoke** » Wed, 8. Nov 17, 12:27

This last episode has finally lost me - words fail me on how bad it was - the only thing that would make me watch the next episode is just to see if it was getting worse.

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Star Trek - Discovery