Aegis Weapon System.

[giskard]

Hello all.

I talked to Reven about his turret script and really liked the idea behind it. I decided to give it a try and found it on sale in Omicron Lyrea.

It was at about this time I decided never to buy the thing when i noticed it had a price tag of....wait for it.......54 Million.

Thats right, no mistake, 54 million for a turret script.
Even if it instantly destroyed any target it shot at id never say it was worth anywhere close to that price. 30,000 credits perhaps tops.

Me thinks somebody has started on drinking his Christmas beer a little to early.

Still the Mk3 trader suddenly does not look so over priced anymore. But thats another price complain

Cough 100,000 Cough MK3.

Giskard

[Nanook]

Hello all.

I talked to Reven about his turret script and really liked the idea behind it. I decided to give it a try and found it on sale in Omicron Lyrea.

It was at about this time I decided never to buy the thing when i noticed it had a price tag of....wait for it.......54 Million.

Thats right, no mistake, 54 million for a turret script.
Even if it instantly destroyed any target it shot at id never say it was worth anywhere close to that price. 30,000 credits perhaps tops.

Me thinks somebody has started on drinking his Christmas beer a little to early.

Still the Mk3 trader suddenly does not look so over priced anymore. But thats another price complain

Cough 100,000 Cough MK3.

Giskard

Don't know about the AEGIS system, haven't used it yet. But the MKIII Trader script is not overpriced. By the time it reaches level 10, it'll have paid for itself. And it doesn't take it long to reach its max of level 25. At 50K cr/lvl, that's 1.25 million credits profit. Not a bad return on investment. Personally, I stopped using the UT part of the script and stick to just the sector traders because I think the Universe Trader makes way too much money. To me, it's a cheat.

[Reven]

How much is it worth to triple the combat efficiency of a capital ship?

As I've said in other posts, people who balk at the cost are comparing its price to other X² products. They aren't looking at the price from a cost-benefit perspective, and they certainly aren't looking at the cost compared to how rediculously easy it is to make money.

25 mil per assassination. 120-250 mil per Xenon Invasion. The cost of AEGIS isn't losing me any sleep.

[EDIT:] I should add that a common misconception is that that the AEGIS upgrade is absolutely required to use gunnery crews, and it's not. You only need to hire the crew to use the "Gunnery Crew: Action Stations" command.

[Warchild]

I dunno... 54 Mil is a bit steep for a gunnery system. Perhaps itreally good...but it still doesn't make you any money by having it.
It doesn't trade...and there certainly isn't any money coming in just because you have it.
Just because you can go into a dog fight with a Corvette and pretty much ensure you're going to come out alive doesn't really mean much.
A destroyer....lets see...heavy weapons....heavy shielding....not much is really going to hurt it that isn't going to get blown to bits trying...with the exception of another destroyer or a Xenon carrier...but ...if you can't do it with one Destroyer...bring two... nothing like death through superior fire power.
You also have to keep in mind that not only do you have to pay the 54 Mil for the Aegis system...you also have to pay the gunnery crew as well... and as I understand it...they must be related to Donald Trump as you have to pay them with a small galactic bank and trust to pay them...and its not like you can skimp on the fees..it comes out automatically.
Somehow...I can't imagine how many support crew would be needed on a Corvette...but I'd like to see them all fit into that tiny little turret
Faces all pressd up against the polymer-fiber plexiglass
Now that would be a sight.
Wonder how the gunner would actually be able to activate the turret controls...Hmmm...bet they'd all get Turret Syndrom..
ok..ok..so that wasn't that funny.
In anycase, I think its very over priced. Good thing you don't need the Aegis system to get the gunnery crew...other wise it would never happen for me.
Thats just my opinion though.
I can see a high price tag on it due to the accuracy of the canons after you have the Aegis system installed...but 54 Million??
I can see 4 Million...and even 10 million...But 54 million is a bit much...and paying the crew should be lowered as well...but then again...its like having a ship fully crewed...have to pay the crew something.
I just wish that it was a "crew" and not a "Gunnery support team". That doesn't make too much sense...in a way it does..and in a way it doesn'tt.
I really can't see 65 personel in a turret support team.
I can see hiring a crew for the ship and a specialized crew for the turrets...but not that many for a turret.
I figure that if you can afford the Destroyer or Carrier...you might be able to afford the crew as well.
Ok..I vented...sort of...just had to let loose.
Cheers

[Reven]

but it still doesn't make you any money by having it.
It doesn't trade...and there certainly isn't any money coming in just because you have it.

The AEGIS system as I said, isn't required in order to have gunnery crews. But, if you have the AEGIS system, you get a new command "Gunnery Crews: Maximize Captures". Makes capturing a Xenon K a lot easier - especially if you are flying a Ray or a Titan.

That can make you a lot of money.

[Midge]

I downloaded and installed the bonus plugin or whatever the name of the day is. Last night, I bought an AEGIS system for my flagship and ...... I'm still trying to get crew. Sheesh! Those military personell disappear faster than pizzas at a pizza eating contest. I saw a transport about to land at the trading station in Home of Light. As I was busy picking off spawning Xenon fighters in X472 after clearing the capital ships, I sent my centaur with docked peggy. By the time the peggy landed in the TS, the 4 military personell were already gone. Not only that, I discovered that the MP were L class wares and take 3 cargo units. Couldn't have picked them up in my peggy anyway. Thought that since passengers took 2 units, I would be able to pick up 4 MP in the peggy. Now the transports themselves have become elusive. In an hour, checking the Argon sectors every 5 - 10 minutes, I didn't see any more transports.

I have no problem with the price. I can afford about 130 of them ATM. I haven't seen it stated expicitly anywhere, but the upgrade seems to be intended for intermediate/advanced stages of the game where the player should have a substantial stream of income. Even if you've blown your entire savings on your first M2, by that time it shouldn't take long to make another 54M.

[jdm5000]

Revan,

How well does this script help a Xenon K? I've heard you mention Titans, Oddysses, and Rays are helped the most, but what about a K?

[jdm5000]

...they must be related to Donald Trump as you have to pay them with a small galactic bank and trust to pay them...

HA! No kidding.. I figured it out the other day that if CR = USD, based on an 8 hour work day, they would make $9,692,800 a year for JUST ONE CREWMEMBER!

Now, I know USD does not equal CR. The CR is worth more! Look at mass driver ammo, what is it, like 300CR for 200 shots?

Do you think I could buy a single 16in shell for a US Navy ship for $1.50?

[klaatu]

I talked to Reven about his turret script and really liked the idea behind it. I decided to give it a try and found it on sale in Omicron Lyrea.

It was at about this time I decided never to buy the thing when i noticed it had a price tag of....wait for it.......54 Million.

Well, I hope you like it alot, because whether or not you decide to use it on your cap ships, the enemy will. They get it for free. They don't have to hire gunnery crews from the Argon. They don't have to buy the AEGIS system. They don't have to pay crew members to run it. They don't have to use space in their cargo holds for the crew (since they don't need crew). They don't need to turn "Action Stations" on or off; they can just run with it on all the time.

Really, I hope you like it alot. Because if you don't, your SOL. That is, unless you're willing to just throw away your gameplay since you installed it. Because that looks like the only way to truely purge it from your game (in addition to deleting the plugin's files manually).

Anyway, I hope you like it. Alot.

[giskard]

Reven:

Exactly how would you rate 1 Dragon armed with the Aegis verse 7 dragons without it ?

Or 1 Boron Ray with it verse 2 Boron Rays without it ?

I make this comparision because thats how many fully equiped dragons you can buy for 54 million.

What your doing by pricing it that high is asking this question of the player. If you had 54 million would you buy

A) The Aegis Addon.
Or
B) A brand new M2.

Given the choice I know which way id go every time.

Besides a lot of players are traders not combat freaks and simply dont place the same value on the Aegis as the few hardcore combat freaks would. Even the combat freaks would need to have a rediculas amount of money to equipe their entire fleet with them.

The Mk3 trader software was also priced too highly. You just need to compare the sector trader profits to the universe trader profits to see the 2 features should be separated if the price is to stay that high.

So there is a trend to price things too highly developing.

Anyway i dont want you to read this thinking the script is not good idea and not needed, I think it is. You did some great work on it but in truth the uses I planned to put it too means that price is too steep. Id like to have put it on a few M3's fighters with turrets, a TL and some M6s mainly or perhaps in my universe traders for added protection. But at that price its a none starter of an idea.

I had hoped it would aid my Dragons on patrol but at that price i doubt it would be a benefit when you compare how effective 7 dragons would be versa Khaak cluster vs 1 dragon with the aegis vs the same cluster.

Giskard

[frymaster]

They don't have to buy the AEGIS system.

They don't get the AEGIS system.

@giskard - for a dragon, AEGIS is probably not worth it. Gunnery crews, however, are

AEGIS adds help when targeting multiple fighters with different sides of your ship, makes turrets track faster, and prioritises targeting more. None of these are really relevent to, say, Novas, which only require the basic gunner. AEGIS is NOT the same as "gunnery crews"

[Reven]

I'll put this in the FAQ too. The only AI ships that this plugin rung gunnery crews commands on are M1 and M2 class ships. No AI corvette runs it. You do not need gunnery crews on a corvette in order to "keep up" with the AI if you are fighting other AI corvettes, M3s and M2s. On the other hand, if you take a corvette up against a Titan or a Ray, you'll probably get handed your heiny now.

AEGIS isn't really intended for corvettes (though I have so much money in my game that I've outfitted my favourite corvette with one). A corvette's turret usually won't see enough other ships at once to make AEGIS effective anyways. The only thing that AEGIS would do for a corvette is give it better counter-missile fire.

[jdm5000]

I'll put this in the FAQ too. The only AI ships that this plugin rung gunnery crews commands on are M1 and M2 class ships. No AI corvette runs it. You do not need gunnery crews on a corvette in order to "keep up" with the AI if you are fighting other AI corvettes, M3s and M2s. On the other hand, if you take a corvette up against a Titan or a Ray, you'll probably get handed your heiny now.

AEGIS isn't really intended for corvettes (though I have so much money in my game that I've outfitted my favourite corvette with one). A corvette's turret usually won't see enough other ships at once to make AEGIS effective anyways. The only thing that AEGIS would do for a corvette is give it better counter-missile fire.

What about gunnery crews? Would the increased rate of fire help the corvettes any significant amount?

[frymaster]

hell yes! The gunnery crews are well worth installing on anything with a turret that you take into combat - probably not transports, as a) you don't want them to get into combat and b) most of their combat is OOS anyway, and so presumably not for OOSD M6s, but anything that has turrets that you use in-sector will benefit from this.

[Reven]

Corvettes will benefit from the increased fire, yes, and from better missile defense. Titans and Dragons get excellent missile defense because they can use mass drivers. With the ability to fire the mass driver at its full rated 20 rounds per second, missiles don't last long. The Nemesis also will benefit from the weapon switching capability.

The cost of an active crew member is not salary. The "salary" is 100 credits per hour. The other 1400 credits are the added costs of running a live crew. Support, infrastructure, maintenance, medical, etc etc etc. The actual salary is the least expensive part in any military of the costs associated with an active soldier.

[frymaster]

my mum is a PA in the financial sector. When a company got something wrong and she had to deal with their mistake, she invoiced them at something like £50 an hour for her labour. Does she get paid £50 an hour? Does she heck!! That figure included her wage, the cost of the facilities and resources she used, and the cost of the work she should have been doing but wasn't. It's exactly the same with the crews.

[stella]

I was quite vociferous in my condemnation of the AEGIS costing to begin with, but that was based on my misconception that it was a "must have".

If you can afford it, get it, but remember to keep well stocked up on mozzies.

Now I understand what it actually does (apologies to Reven in a roundabout way for going off at half-****), I agree with him.

I know that all AI ships have full gunnery crews, but are you sure that they all have AEGIS as well? Reven, can you confirm this?

[giskard]

stella: Reven did confirm that on Devnet when i asked him directly. I dont want to spoil it for you by giving you full details on what Reven said other than to say Revens Aegis system is fair in the way its implimented. I recently took on a few big bad guys and survived, they have not suddenly become super bad guys over night but are a little smarter these days.

Nanook: I have covered 70% of the X Universe map with sector traders in my game and I found sector traders spend most of their time on standby, so they dont earn the 500,000 credits backs that quickly. You can wait several in game days for them to make 180,000 credits. Only the ones placed in the best sectors ever make more than that at any decent rate.

At any one time 75% of my sector traders are on stand by in sectors ive not developed further.

The Universe traders do seem to make a lot more money, i estimated it to be 20 times more money than the best sector traders. They go from level 8 to level 25 faster than the sector traders go from level 0 to level 8. So im inclined to agree with you here.

Giskard

[Reven]

I know that all AI ships have full gunnery crews, but are you sure that they all have AEGIS as well? Reven, can you confirm this?

No, they do not all have AEGIS.

[stella]

Thank gawd for that