Update 4.10 - Overview of progress and plans

[Karvat]

Everything looks nice except one simple thing that i really can't understand about these updates... Why putting so much effort to improve the terraforming feature, if the reward after all that effort is minimal, when you restart the game you lose all of your progresses, and literally 0% of the people playing this game has arrived at the end of all the terraforming missions.

Adding terraforming projects is honestly a waste of resources and developing time that could really be used for something elese in my opinion.
There are 7 terraforming projects, nobody has even arrived close to complete them all, why adding two more?

The Steam "0%" is rounded, it just means less than 0.05% / 0.1% did it (depending how/if the round, they only show x.y precision). Kinda like the x-treme achievements.

That's not even the point, thing is that after all that developing time and resources, and after hours and hours of playing, spending milions of credits, effort, resources and time, you just get some shaders on a planet in the background and that's it, which makes this entire feature just disappointing and pointless over certain limits...

Instead of maybe adding thousands of other possible features way more interesting than that.

And i am going to make even an example of this... I am completely against the planetary landing, but imagine if instead of adding this terraforming feature (which is apparently useless for 99,95% of the players), they would have instead added a new station module that allows you to interact with any planet since the beginning of the game, opening an interface and allowing you to trade with those planets.

That would have been a 1000 times better feature that everyone could have played since the beginning of the game, 1000 times more interesting, attractive to new possible players and better than terraforming.

And i assume it would have taken exactly the same amount of developing time and resoruces.

[CBJ]

The terraforming changes in this update are all fixes for problems encountered by players while playing it. You personally may not find that portion of the game interesting, but others do and have been waiting for those fixes.

[grapedog]

Everything looks nice except one simple thing that i really can't understand about these updates... Why putting so much effort to improve the terraforming feature, if the reward after all that effort is minimal, when you restart the game you lose all of your progresses, and literally 0% of the people playing this game has arrived at the end of all the terraforming missions.

Adding terraforming projects is honestly a waste of resources and developing time that could really be used for something elese in my opinion.
There are 7 terraforming projects, nobody has even arrived close to complete them all, why adding two more?

The Steam "0%" is rounded, it just means less than 0.05% / 0.1% did it (depending how/if the round, they only show x.y precision). Kinda like the x-treme achievements.

That's not even the point, thing is that after all that developing time and resources, and after hours and hours of playing, spending milions of credits, effort, resources and time, you just get some shaders on a planet in the background and that's it, which makes this entire feature just disappointing and pointless over certain limits...

Instead of maybe adding thousands of other possible features way more interesting than that.

You also get things like group skill training, can reduce pirate activity, can earn lots of credits.... it's more than just shaders on a planet.

[jlehtone]

apparently useless for 99,95% of the players
1000 times better feature
1000 times more interesting

Those are your opinions and estimates. I'll divide those numbers with the time I've played X4 according to Steam.
Oh no, division by zero is not allowed.

The point is that we don't have comprehensive statistics and even if we had, quantification would still be practically impossible.


"Trade with planets" would be not only trade with a station that is called "planet", but also a can of worms. Earlier games had it. X4 does its best to follow a different philosophy. That is good.

IMHO, Egosoft may freely add what they want and fix what the can.

[Raptor34]

Earlier games had it. X4 does its best to follow a different philosophy. That is good.

No they didn't. Or at least none I remember.

[Raevyan]

The terraforming changes in this update are all fixes for problems encountered by players while playing it. You personally may not find that portion of the game interesting, but others do and have been waiting for those fixes.

Well you could make terraforming more interesting for a lot more people if you‘d make the pilot training more available. For example, add a new project before/after the first mass teleport to build the training facility in the hq sector. The training is behind a big wall where people generally don’t care anymore about skilled pilots. If it was available earlier on, it would make much more sense.

[Falcrack]

The terraforming changes in this update are all fixes for problems encountered by players while playing it. You personally may not find that portion of the game interesting, but others do and have been waiting for those fixes.

Well you could make terraforming more interesting for a lot more people if you‘d make the pilot training more available. For example, add a new project before/after the first mass teleport to build the training facility in the hq sector. The training is behind a big wall where people generally don’t care anymore about skilled pilots. If it was available earlier on, it would make much more sense.

Agreed, it makes very little logical sense to lock something as fundamental as training pilots and crew behind something like terraforming a planet...

[Artean]

That would have been a 1000 times better feature that everyone could have played since the beginning of the game, 1000 times more interesting, attractive to new possible players and better than terraforming.

Seems you misunderstood the intention of terraforming completely. But that's fine.

[Raptor34]

The terraforming changes in this update are all fixes for problems encountered by players while playing it. You personally may not find that portion of the game interesting, but others do and have been waiting for those fixes.

Well you could make terraforming more interesting for a lot more people if you‘d make the pilot training more available. For example, add a new project before/after the first mass teleport to build the training facility in the hq sector. The training is behind a big wall where people generally don’t care anymore about skilled pilots. If it was available earlier on, it would make much more sense.

That's not the problem tbh. Its how fiddly it is clicking around, transferring people in and out.
They really need to overhaul that particular UI.
Like imagine being able to create a store of lvl 3 pilots at your shipyard, and having new ships pickup those pilots automatically. That would be very valuable.

[Raevyan]

The terraforming changes in this update are all fixes for problems encountered by players while playing it. You personally may not find that portion of the game interesting, but others do and have been waiting for those fixes.

Well you could make terraforming more interesting for a lot more people if you‘d make the pilot training more available. For example, add a new project before/after the first mass teleport to build the training facility in the hq sector. The training is behind a big wall where people generally don’t care anymore about skilled pilots. If it was available earlier on, it would make much more sense.

That's not the problem tbh. Its how fiddly it is clicking around, transferring people in and out.
They really need to overhaul that particular UI.
Like imagine being able to create a store of lvl 3 pilots at your shipyard, and having new ships pickup those pilots automatically. That would be very valuable.

1400 clicks to get 100 pilots into group training to 4* and another 1400 for the 5*. I‘ve done it, it’s horrible, don’t know what they were even thinking about when they developed this particular part.... clearly no one of them has actually used it once. It’s pretty late but they finally change that with 4.10 whenever it will be released...

[Raptor34]

Well you could make terraforming more interesting for a lot more people if you‘d make the pilot training more available. For example, add a new project before/after the first mass teleport to build the training facility in the hq sector. The training is behind a big wall where people generally don’t care anymore about skilled pilots. If it was available earlier on, it would make much more sense.

That's not the problem tbh. Its how fiddly it is clicking around, transferring people in and out.
They really need to overhaul that particular UI.
Like imagine being able to create a store of lvl 3 pilots at your shipyard, and having new ships pickup those pilots automatically. That would be very valuable.

1400 clicks to get 100 pilots into group training to 4* and another 1400 for the 5*. I‘ve done it, it’s horrible, don’t know what they were even thinking about when they developed this particular part.... clearly no one of them has actually used it once. It’s pretty late but they finally change that with 4.10 whenever it will be released...

Oh wow, they did. Missed that part.

[Endealon]

No solution to the real main problems.

-No drastic change to horrible AI.

-No profound change to the hideous UI.

Congratulations. Keep up the good work.

[grapedog]

No solution to the real main problems.

-No drastic change to horrible AI.

-No profound change to the hideous UI.

Congratulations. Keep up the good work.

Everyone has different main problems.... yours, because they're yours, seem more important... but for some people, fixing terraforming, or mining, or getting ventures back, or any other thing could have been the main problem for them.

[Endealon]

No solution to the real main problems.

-No drastic change to horrible AI.

-No profound change to the hideous UI.

Congratulations. Keep up the good work.

Everyone has different main problems.... yours, because they're yours, seem more important... but for some people, fixing terraforming, or mining, or getting ventures back, or any other thing could have been the main problem for them.

Oh I understand. Let me tell you about some of "my" main problems. You and others may be affected by:

-The Xenon AI. Xenons just don't mean anything in the current version of the game. Since they are the main opposing faction, it may be a problem that affects other players.

-AI combat and fleet management. Our ships are just plain stupid. Since combat is one of the core parts of the game, I guess it doesn't just affect me.

-The UI is awful. Make 14 clicks for something that could be done in 3 or a map management that is the opposite of comfort, to name something. Considering everyone uses the UI, I don't think it's something that only affects me.

Compared to all of this, the topics you cited are insignificant.

[Fulgrymm]

Yes, do keep up the good work, and do your best not to be dragged down by the negative folks.

[BelatedHero]

Oh I understand. Let me tell you about some of "my" main problems. You and others may be affected by:

-The Xenon AI. Xenons just don't mean anything in the current version of the game. Since they are the main opposing faction, it may be a problem that affects other players.

-AI combat and fleet management. Our ships are just plain stupid. Since combat is one of the core parts of the game, I guess it doesn't just affect me.

-The UI is awful. Make 14 clicks for something that could be done in 3 or a map management that is the opposite of comfort, to name something. Considering everyone uses the UI, I don't think it's something that only affects me.

Compared to all of this, the topics you cited are insignificant.

Your final statement shows that while you may understand grapedog's point, you do not believe it. Calling the concerns of others "insignificant" shows you do not respect the right of others to think something else is more important.

I too have issues with all three of your points, and while I consider them substantial places for improvement as well, I disagree they are the top 3. This patch seems to address many big pain points I face and I am looking forward to its arrival.

[elektrohawk]

No solution to the real main problems.

-No drastic change to horrible AI.

-No profound change to the hideous UI.

Congratulations. Keep up the good work.

Everyone has different main problems.... yours, because they're yours, seem more important... but for some people, fixing terraforming, or mining, or getting ventures back, or any other thing could have been the main problem for them.

Oh I understand. Let me tell you about some of "my" main problems. You and others may be affected by:

-The Xenon AI. Xenons just don't mean anything in the current version of the game. Since they are the main opposing faction, it may be a problem that affects other players.

-AI combat and fleet management. Our ships are just plain stupid. Since combat is one of the core parts of the game, I guess it doesn't just affect me.

-The UI is awful. Make 14 clicks for something that could be done in 3 or a map management that is the opposite of comfort, to name something. Considering everyone uses the UI, I don't think it's something that only affects me.

Compared to all of this, the topics you cited are insignificant.

It's fortunate then that you're wrong. The topics they mentioned are far more significant than your examples. End game crew training was completely horrible, the UI for it made it not worth doing through terraforming, and that is fixed. Station miners and even managers were having such significant problems, that threads were popping up daily about it being broken/unplayable, and that's getting addressed. The return of ventures, in a more fleshed out state is something that has frankly been promised and requested since launch.

Your wants of a stronger Xenon is an issue a number of people have raised, but your assertion that they are the main opposing faction is incorrect. Who the player chooses to go up against, is the main opposing faction, the xenon are a threat to the universe, but they're also not intended (as far as I'm aware) to be some destructive force that will wipe out all the non-player factions, should the player neglect to aid them. It's a difficult balancing act, particularly with the introduction of terrans and their roaming anti-xenon fleets, but this is only one issue, and not as big of one as you make out.

As for AI combat and fleet management, OOS combat calculations are a bit odd, but ships aren't that stupid. Do you even watch them fight? It's pretty impressive most of the time, for being computer controlled, on the scale that it's at. Further, if you had bothered to read the tentative patch notes, you would have seen that there are fixes in it for ship combat AI, like ships holding their fire against boarding targets that have gotten too low hp.

As for the UI, this is also exactly what is being addressed with some of the changes, like the terraforming crew training changes. They are quite literally reducing the number of tedious clicks to do through the UI.


TL:DR; They're fixing aspects of what you're complaining about, but you don't care, and only seem to be interested in criticizing what many people are interested in. Also, not everyone plays through steam: GOG is another primary distributor of X4

[EtherealZucchini]

Still no fix for crews of ships built at player stations not using the race of the station habitats?

[LandogarX4]

I sure hope the Xenon balancing gets fixed in the upcoming beta. I haven't been playing in weeks since I don't want the other races to wipe out the pathetically weak Xenon.

[Sassbarman]

With regards to making the xenon a threat again does anyone feel that a simple increasing of the range of their main gravitron turrets on the K’s and I’s would make a huge difference.