'FIGHT': This is how quick all Xenon can be destroyed.

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'FIGHT': This is how quick all Xenon can be destroyed.

Post by Omni-Orb » Fri, 19. Nov 21, 19:25

TLDR: ingame time 2days 4hours.
I only play un-modded. This run was done in 4.20. The X series is on my top spot favourite game series of all time, and i have been gaming intensely since the NES years.
X4 is truly a beatifully made game that has a massive amount of future potential and is truly living up to its 'Foundations' name.
This is a showcase run for Egosoft to see how quick the 'FIGHT' aspect in this game is over for combat players.

Here is some of what i learned this run and what i think can be changed:

To me it seems the game is all about the long term 'TRADE' aspect, and that the 'FIGHT' aspect of X4 is too short next to the immensely massive 'TRADE' and 'BUILD' system.
I have to say that the personal combat in X4 is absolutely beautifully done and feels fantastic, it is simply that the progression of player power is far too quick and the amount of enemies dont feel 'intense' like combat should.
I feel that a good change would be slightly more xenon total amount of ships, double the amount of shipyards and warfs or modules that produce ships so xenon can replace lost ships quicker.
And have xenons be more agressive in attacking other factions, while also having defence stations be strategically placed like shipyards and warfs are instead of random.
As a 'FIGHT' type player, i feel like the early and mid game is over too fast because of easy capping and quick, easy and cheap access to S/M ships.
And at the moment i feel that the early and mid game is the most entertaining however to stay there for any amount of time i have to put severe limits and rules on how to play.
Its too easy once we know where abandoned ships are, specifically the destroyer.
Hopefully the abandoned ships gets randomzied just like in x3 to encourage and reward exploration.

I dont much play the 'TRADE' part of the game beyond equipping combat ships, completing missions and researching,
however i am humbled and amazed by the fact that the economy is there supporting the whole game which makes the 'FIGHT' part more interresting, since destroying trade ships for example can be an effective way to control a war.
I hope that the early/mid game gets balanced to be last at least as long lasting as the late/end game, and that the 'FIGHT' aspect is respected more and that the challenge of it is improved. There are different ways of fighting, anything from completely playing it from the map from the safety of a big base,
to spearheading the fight in a custom ship or the bridge of a battleship or teleporting from ship to ship micromanaging combat that way,
or using a dragon corvette with 6 torpedo launchers doing flyby travel drive drift style bombing runs on capital ships, destroying them without being hit.
Afterall for me and for many others 'FIGHT' is the most entertaining part of the game.

Things like changing ship hull prices to something like x5 or x10 what it is and leaving equipment prices the same as it is would go a long way to balance it from a non 'trade' players perspective.
Same as doubling or more the price of stations since they easily pay for themselves 100 times over in the long run.
It is too easy to make too much money, and when we do the game gets to a "bland" stage where nothing feels really rewarding.
Most of the real entertainment is early/mid game when needing to pilot an S/M ship, and the feeling that any victory and accomplishment is important.
I hope boarding changes to require having shields down to board a target, so we cant just choose any ship to claim as our own while having no firepower to back up the boarding operation at least from a 'FIGHT' players perspective.


Here is the report on the run i did:

This run was a sortof speedrun to see how fast i could destroy all the xenon even though it was totally relaxed.
I used the accomplished scientist game start and spent the early game by collecting the abandoned destroyer that i
sold for 9 million, then i bought 19 argon ides trader ships with marines and boarded an asgard on the second attempt.
With all 19 traders left intact and just about 0 credits, i sold the traders and bought more marines for the asgard.
I also did the missions for basic mods while the boarding was happening and was done with the boarding and basic mod missions 2 hours into the game.

Continued the game with doing a few "flyby boardings" with the asgard untill i had something like 50 million credits.
Started deleting xenon from the universe, specifically tharkas cascade and savage spur, while collecting items for modding.
I installed basic mods on the asgard, and was done with this at around hour 4-5.

13 hours into the game i captured the 2nd asgard and by then i had destroyed 3 xenon shipyards and 3 wharfs.
I made sure to destroy as many of the supply/mining ships as possible in the same sectors while i destroyed the wharfs and shipyards, since they funneled at those points.
The thought was that if i cut production for the xenon the other races would help speed up their destruction.
The new area of effect explosion really helped against the swarm of defence drones since i could tactically destroy 2 low hull modules with 1 asgard main beam shot,
and 1 more within 6 shots of the other main weapons, desroying most of the swarm and leaving the rest severely damaged and quick for the flak turrets to destroy.
While doing this i also collected the trade goods to complete the research, while researching mods and teleportation.

20 hours into the game and i just captured and re-equipped the third asgard, just finished destroying the 6th xenon shipyard and 6th warf while clearing the sector from mining and trading xenon ships.
Sold inventory items for around 35 million. The last two sectors put up a good fight, i sent in two of the asgards, which where unmodded in by mistake and had to emergency teleport to them,
Xenon Ks where incoming from multiple directions, the slow motion of the turning asgards increasing the intensity of the situation.
Fought off 8 Ks and an I by teleporting between the asgards micromanaging their beam weapons. inspirationally intense combat.

1day 7hours:The initial destruction of shipyards and wharfs shows now, i have at most seen 10 xenon mining/trading ships while i scouted for xenon stations in the whole universe.
Xenon ships are pretty much gone from the universe and the other races are expanding into xenon space, not much help in destroying stations though.
Spending most of the time tabbed out of the game while it runs in the background and the three asgards work on deleting stations. There is no more xenon threats in the galaxy mostly.
After the first 20 hours the personal cockpit control part of the combat gameplay is over, and even if short it concluded in an epic xenon last stand battle, and the only real thing left to do is delete the stations from 'dead' xenon sectors while being afk in a scout ship.

1day 18 hours: Cleared out atyas misfortune, faulty logic, emperors pride, rhys defiance, matrix #59B and scale plate green so far, still havent seen another asgard from the terrans.
Started using SETA, while deleting the last stations.

2day 01hours: Finished clearing out tharkas cascade and savage spur.
Saw the 4th terran asgard, decided not to capture it since there was only 3 sectors left to clear and i was getting bored having nothing else to do than being tabbed out of the game with 3 asgards queued to delete stations while seta is active.

2days 4hours: All xenon are destroyed.

Save file: https://easyupload.io/lg2m6k
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Last edited by Omni-Orb on Fri, 19. Nov 21, 22:24, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 'FIGHT' Here is a game report on how quick the Xenon can be destroyed.

Post by Pesanur » Fri, 19. Nov 21, 20:42

Strategically placed defence stations is a thing that all the factions need, not only Xenons. And by the way, they need to be fully armed defence stations since the start, not poorly armed such now.
Is a joke that factions that are at war to have randomly placed and poorly armed defence stations in the front line sectors.

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Re: 'FIGHT': This is how quick all Xenon can be destroyed.

Post by Manawydn » Sat, 20. Nov 21, 02:33

I agree, all factions main battlegroups and defensive structures should be maxed out and armed to the teeth. Leave the Mk.1 stuff to the civilian plebs who have to pay money for them

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Re: 'FIGHT': This is how quick all Xenon can be destroyed.

Post by LameFox » Sat, 20. Nov 21, 02:47

The state of exploration and abandoned ships is sad. I totally ignore both at this point, preferring to capture ships instead. Even that is too easy though, in part because they've upped the effectiveness of smaller ships compared to larger ones, and in part because capital ships have no, NO defence against a player at all. It is quite literally easier (if slower) to capture something like a Behemoth or Phoenix with my early Minotaur Raider than it is to take the Minotaur Raider with my starting fighter, because at least I need to manoeuvre to keep out of its guns.

I wish they would delete this silly player-only gravity well cheat from the game completely, or at least allow me to turn it off.

That said, I didn't know you could still swarm an Asgard with transports to capture it? Last few times I tried boarding something with the hull over 80% it simply never triggered even on the highest breach setting. I thought they had patched it out.
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Re: 'FIGHT': This is how quick all Xenon can be destroyed.

Post by Omni-Orb » Sat, 20. Nov 21, 17:22

LameFox wrote:
Sat, 20. Nov 21, 02:47
That said, I didn't know you could still swarm an Asgard with transports to capture it? Last few times I tried boarding something with the hull over 80% it simply never triggered even on the highest breach setting. I thought they had patched it out.
We need to have the setting on 'very strong'. It does trigger, however takes a very long time. Most times all transports get away from the asgard without being destroyed.
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Re: 'FIGHT': This is how quick all Xenon can be destroyed.

Post by flywlyx » Sat, 20. Nov 21, 21:00

TER Asgard should be filled with 3 stars marines to protect itself. It is way too easy to board an Asgard comparing to build one.

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Re: 'FIGHT' Here is a game report on how quick the Xenon can be destroyed.

Post by flywlyx » Sat, 20. Nov 21, 21:09

Pesanur wrote:
Fri, 19. Nov 21, 20:42
Strategically placed defence stations is a thing that all the factions need, not only Xenons. And by the way, they need to be fully armed defence stations since the start, not poorly armed such now.
Is a joke that factions that are at war to have randomly placed and poorly armed defence stations in the front line sectors.
Xenon stations' problem is not only location, the biggest weakness is turret range

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Re: 'FIGHT': This is how quick all Xenon can be destroyed.

Post by Malchar » Sun, 21. Nov 21, 04:45

PhotonPulse wrote:
Sat, 20. Nov 21, 17:22

We need to have the setting on 'very strong'.
On an other hand, you placed the trigger on very strong ... on yourself. Playing terran is almost cheating ;-)

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Re: 'FIGHT': This is how quick all Xenon can be destroyed.

Post by Imperial Good » Sun, 21. Nov 21, 07:07

Pesanur wrote:
Fri, 19. Nov 21, 20:42
And by the way, they need to be fully armed defence stations since the start, not poorly armed such now.
The main issue is an economic one. They order turrets, a lot of them, but few get built because most of the advanced electronics go towards ship building as they are always in major short supply.
Manawydn wrote:
Sat, 20. Nov 21, 02:33
I agree, all factions main battlegroups and defensive structures should be maxed out and armed to the teeth. Leave the Mk.1 stuff to the civilian plebs who have to pay money for them
There are only mk1 turrets.

Better shields do not matter much since by the time the L shields protecting the L turrets on defence modules start to fail, the module is likely about to die anyway.
LameFox wrote:
Sat, 20. Nov 21, 02:47
I wish they would delete this silly player-only gravity well cheat from the game completely, or at least allow me to turn it off.
The issue is more the AI does not respond to the player doing that appropriately. If the player is trying to cheese a L or XL ship like that, the AI should call in S and M ships from nearby to engage the player. Sure some ships can probably still be cheesed like that, but good luck on most L ships with exposed surfaces.
flywlyx wrote:
Sat, 20. Nov 21, 21:00
TER Asgard should be filled with 3 stars marines to protect itself. It is way too easy to board an Asgard comparing to build one.
Boarding in general needs to be made much more difficult. Specifically dumping marines and running away should not work, with the marines being "captured" due to lack of support should the ship make it to dock at a station, or if enough S and M ships are in the area. The AI should respond to such boarding operations by calling for help and trying to out swarm the player to cause it to fail. This would mean that the Asgard could not be captured by swarming it with transports full of marines, and instead would need to be captured in an actual fight, which should also involve a lot of other Terran ships so be non-trivial.
flywlyx wrote:
Sat, 20. Nov 21, 21:09
Xenon stations' problem is not only location, the biggest weakness is turret range
Which for the most part is fine as the NPCs fail to take advantage of that, preferring to face tank the turrets in melee range.

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Re: 'FIGHT': This is how quick all Xenon can be destroyed.

Post by LameFox » Sun, 21. Nov 21, 07:34

PhotonPulse wrote:
Sat, 20. Nov 21, 17:22
LameFox wrote:
Sat, 20. Nov 21, 02:47
That said, I didn't know you could still swarm an Asgard with transports to capture it? Last few times I tried boarding something with the hull over 80% it simply never triggered even on the highest breach setting. I thought they had patched it out.
We need to have the setting on 'very strong'. It does trigger, however takes a very long time. Most times all transports get away from the asgard without being destroyed.
I will try it again sometime, but the last one took a very long time, probably 10-15 minutes of real time and I even tried to use SETA to speed it up but nothing happened until I brought the hull down. I always use the highest setting so I don't think that was an issue.
Imperial Good wrote:
Sun, 21. Nov 21, 07:07
LameFox wrote:
Sat, 20. Nov 21, 02:47
I wish they would delete this silly player-only gravity well cheat from the game completely, or at least allow me to turn it off.
The issue is more the AI does not respond to the player doing that appropriately. If the player is trying to cheese a L or XL ship like that, the AI should call in S and M ships from nearby to engage the player. Sure some ships can probably still be cheesed like that, but good luck on most L ships with exposed surfaces.
There are quite often fighters trying to attack me as I do this, but they're not very good at knowing which angle to approach from, so it does not matter much really. I dispatch them while using the capital as cover then continue to cripple it.

To me there's just no reason for that 'feature' to exist. We can already disable a ship's engines and then hugging it is no problem. Making it unable to manoeuvre even while its engines still work is a huge, unnecessary advantage for players, and we cannot even opt out of it because going near the ship makes it happen by itself.
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Re: 'FIGHT': This is how quick all Xenon can be destroyed.

Post by LameFox » Sun, 21. Nov 21, 07:37

Also, boarding does draw aggro in my experience. Everything loves to shoot pods.

However, Intervention Corps Asgards are often the last thing remaining of their fleet, so grabbing one is not too hard. It has no friends to call upon.
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Re: 'FIGHT': This is how quick all Xenon can be destroyed.

Post by Imperial Good » Sun, 21. Nov 21, 07:44

LameFox wrote:
Sun, 21. Nov 21, 07:37
Also, boarding does draw aggro in my experience. Everything loves to shoot pods.
Except once the pods have landed, it is doomed. There is nothing it can do to stop the boarding operation from happening, even if backup arrives and the ship ends up surrounded by a huge fleet. There needs to be some mechanic that forces the player to maintain a dominant presence during the entire boarding operation, and not just let it be a fire and forget task. This buys the AI time to stop the player from easily boarding targets.
LameFox wrote:
Sun, 21. Nov 21, 07:37
However, Intervention Corps Asgards are often the last thing remaining of their fleet, so grabbing one is not too hard. It has no friends to call upon.
Which again is a problem. Once it loses its escorts it should retreat to be reused rather than "suicide" and be replaced. Due to how powerful it is (people report it cleaning entire Xenon sectors solo) it should not even join most of the intervention attack fleets, and only be sent if Xenon are causing massive damage to local sectors (damage limitation, could allow Xenon to be buffed if Cradle of Humanity is installed). Most of the time it should patrol core sectors of Sol where it has access to a ton of backup.

This even fits with the lore since the last thing the Terran government would want is their ATF XL Battery design falling into the hands of some Teladi scrap merchant, or worse, the Argon Federation.

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Re: 'FIGHT': This is how quick all Xenon can be destroyed.

Post by flywlyx » Sun, 21. Nov 21, 08:22

Imperial Good wrote:
Sun, 21. Nov 21, 07:07
Which for the most part is fine as the NPCs fail to take advantage of that, preferring to face tank the turrets in melee range.
They are pretty good at keeping distance since 4.1.
But if it is a player destroyer, I think it needs 3 stars pilot to act smart.

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Re: 'FIGHT': This is how quick all Xenon can be destroyed.

Post by LameFox » Sun, 21. Nov 21, 08:58

Imperial Good wrote:
Sun, 21. Nov 21, 07:44
Except once the pods have landed, it is doomed. There is nothing it can do to stop the boarding operation from happening, even if backup arrives and the ship ends up surrounded by a huge fleet. There needs to be some mechanic that forces the player to maintain a dominant presence during the entire boarding operation, and not just let it be a fire and forget task. This buys the AI time to stop the player from easily boarding targets.
I am pretty sure the marines still die in the pods until they have breached (or maybe begun to breach?) the hull. So at high health like this it wouldn't be doomed if anything was there to shoot them. Pods are super weak. There is a long period where they are quite vulnerable before the stage begins, and if something was picking them off then those who survive to enter the ship (if any) may be repelled by its own marines if thinned out enough.
Imperial Good wrote:
Sun, 21. Nov 21, 07:44
Which again is a problem. Once it loses its escorts it should retreat to be reused rather than "suicide" and be replaced. Due to how powerful it is (people report it cleaning entire Xenon sectors solo) it should not even join most of the intervention attack fleets, and only be sent if Xenon are causing massive damage to local sectors (damage limitation, could allow Xenon to be buffed if Cradle of Humanity is installed). Most of the time it should patrol core sectors of Sol where it has access to a ton of backup.

This even fits with the lore since the last thing the Terran government would want is their ATF XL Battery design falling into the hands of some Teladi scrap merchant, or worse, the Argon Federation.
I do think that in general large ships should attempt to withdraw and repair. A bit dumb that attacks are always suicidal. I guess maybe it saves needing extra AI scripting to rebuild their fleet or something, but in game it feels pretty silly.

That said clearing whole Xenon sectors is a bug with its OOS performance and should be fixed when 4.2 goes live AFAIK.
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Re: 'FIGHT': This is how quick all Xenon can be destroyed.

Post by Sirus5 » Sun, 21. Nov 21, 12:17

I guess this all depends upon your playstyle and aspirations.

I have preferred a more balanced approach and find that exploration, fighting and trading
is more enjoyable - I come home in the evening and do a couple or 3 hours - and in that time
I may capture a couple of minotaurs, build a station or two on some Guild missions etc.
I am currently preparing to board an SCA Rattlesnake which could take a couple of evenings
in getting my marines to the right level etc.
It's something which I use as an evening of fun - flying in a fighter trying to outmaneouvre a
minotaur's missiles and turrets and marvelling at the beautiful scenery whilst trying to micromanage
many ships handling about 20 missions.

I like the fact that you can do something like board without taking the shields down on the odd occasion
it may be fun and although I accept in some people's hands it's a game breaker, to many others it is not
as they would rather do many other things and have this as an occasional perk.

Thus, it would be good to have a switch in settings somewhere for many of the things suggested in these forums
which would enable people like the OP to switch it off and not be able to take over quickly whereas other people
like myself would be able to leave it on and on the very rare occasion have a great time laughing at the
consequences of a useful happy event.

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Re: 'FIGHT': This is how quick all Xenon can be destroyed.

Post by Imperial Good » Sun, 21. Nov 21, 19:31

flywlyx wrote:
Sun, 21. Nov 21, 08:22
They are pretty good at keeping distance since 4.1.
But if it is a player destroyer, I think it needs 3 stars pilot to act smart.
Tell that to my 4 star Syn which decided to fly into the kill zone of a Xenon Defence Station... In 4.10 none of the destroyers maintain a safe distance, especially after they try to reposition.
LameFox wrote:
Sun, 21. Nov 21, 08:58
I am pretty sure the marines still die in the pods until they have breached (or maybe begun to breach?) the hull. So at high health like this it wouldn't be doomed if anything was there to shoot them. Pods are super weak. There is a long period where they are quite vulnerable before the stage begins, and if something was picking them off then those who survive to enter the ship (if any) may be repelled by its own marines if thinned out enough.
Once pods contact hull, marines are safe to take as long as they want to cut. They can then take 2 hours to cut the hull and there is nothing the AI can do to stop them. The ship can even turn friendly again while they are cutting.
LameFox wrote:
Sun, 21. Nov 21, 08:58
A bit dumb that attacks are always suicidal. I guess maybe it saves needing extra AI scripting to rebuild their fleet or something, but in game it feels pretty silly.
It is likely to try and keep the economy ticking over. If all the factions retreated ships that were about to die they would seldom order new ships.
LameFox wrote:
Sun, 21. Nov 21, 08:58
That said clearing whole Xenon sectors is a bug with its OOS performance and should be fixed when 4.2 goes live AFAIK.
Or made worse. Currently the Asgard deals a tiny fraction of its actual low attention damage because it does not point at the target and the damage is only forwards. If they point at the stations they die a lot faster in low attention.

And dealing with an earlier point if they fix the "face tanking" aspect of the Asgard it will then easily clear entire Xenon sectors. XL Main Battery out ranges the Xenon turrets, and deals huge damage. This topic is proof, you can solo entire Xenon sectors with an Asgard. I have done so in mine.

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Re: 'FIGHT': This is how quick all Xenon can be destroyed.

Post by LameFox » Mon, 22. Nov 21, 00:42

Imperial Good wrote:
Sun, 21. Nov 21, 19:31
Once pods contact hull, marines are safe to take as long as they want to cut. They can then take 2 hours to cut the hull and there is nothing the AI can do to stop them. The ship can even turn friendly again while they are cutting.
The ship they are on can't stop them but I think others can. I have in the past tried setting up boarding ops 'hands off' to see if the AI settings would work without my intervention, and if the pods were killed after landing but before breaching, then it ended. Unless this was some sort of bug?

Things that will target them seem to include: laser towers, defence drones, passing fighters that get involved, and the turrets on other ships flying nearby (even traders passing but not joining the fight will fire at them).
Imperial Good wrote:
Sun, 21. Nov 21, 19:31
It is likely to try and keep the economy ticking over. If all the factions retreated ships that were about to die they would seldom order new ships.
I believe very few would retreat successfully, considering they cannot jump, nor engage travel drive under fire. But I also think this game needs a sink for the economy that is not necessarily combat related, as it creates very silly situations sometimes, like a combination of plot choices making the whole game stagnate.
Imperial Good wrote:
Sun, 21. Nov 21, 19:31
Or made worse. Currently the Asgard deals a tiny fraction of its actual low attention damage because it does not point at the target and the damage is only forwards. If they point at the stations they die a lot faster in low attention.

And dealing with an earlier point if they fix the "face tanking" aspect of the Asgard it will then easily clear entire Xenon sectors. XL Main Battery out ranges the Xenon turrets, and deals huge damage. This topic is proof, you can solo entire Xenon sectors with an Asgard. I have done so in mine.
I know in player hands it can, but from what I have seen of their behaviour in-sector the AI is not very good at using them. I often tag along specifically because once the fleet is dead I might be able to borrow one before the Xenon (or whoever it's attacking) get to kill it.

Against stations for instance, the AI pilots will happy lean on the trigger of those L class weapons it has, which I always put on another fire group so my own captains won't use them, because of how badly they harm the XL weapon's recharge. Terrans also seem to suffer from a paradoxical situation where the "best" weapon loadout for their L ships is actually the absolutely least useful one because of how costly their beam turrets are.

Then again, everyone seems to have different results with Xenon. I suppose if they have the resources to send more ships, it will die IS, but if not, it will eventually grind things away even with those guns.
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Re: 'FIGHT': This is how quick all Xenon can be destroyed.

Post by Imperial Good » Mon, 22. Nov 21, 02:50

LameFox wrote:
Mon, 22. Nov 21, 00:42
The ship they are on can't stop them but I think others can. I have in the past tried setting up boarding ops 'hands off' to see if the AI settings would work without my intervention, and if the pods were killed after landing but before breaching, then it ended. Unless this was some sort of bug?
Sounds like a bug. As the pods disappear the instant they contact the target ships's hull. Although honestly I have not tried shooting up the pod remains or boarded in 4.10 (last time was 4.00).
LameFox wrote:
Mon, 22. Nov 21, 00:42
I believe very few would retreat successfully, considering they cannot jump, nor engage travel drive under fire. But I also think this game needs a sink for the economy that is not necessarily combat related, as it creates very silly situations sometimes, like a combination of plot choices making the whole game stagnate.
There are trade stations and terraforming projects for that.

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Re: 'FIGHT': This is how quick all Xenon can be destroyed.

Post by LameFox » Mon, 22. Nov 21, 02:58

Imperial Good wrote:
Mon, 22. Nov 21, 02:50
Sounds like a bug. As the pods disappear the instant they contact the target ships's hull. Although honestly I have not tried shooting up the pod remains or boarded in 4.10 (last time was 4.00).
I have never seen pods vanish on contact when boarding in any version of this game. :o If they are bugged it must be very consistent. Even after the marines have left the pods, they are still there and destructible, and only despawn later.
Imperial Good wrote:
Mon, 22. Nov 21, 02:50
There are trade stations and terraforming projects for that.
Trade stations and things like piracy don't really seem to be enough to keep it afloat when creating a peaceful universe.

Terraforming I have not tried, because even though I do not rush to end all my enemies as the OP did, there is no challenge that remains in the game once I have production sufficient to terraform. At that point there is no reason for me to continue so I start over.
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Re: 'FIGHT': This is how quick all Xenon can be destroyed.

Post by Imperial Good » Mon, 22. Nov 21, 03:10

LameFox wrote:
Mon, 22. Nov 21, 02:58
Trade stations and things like piracy don't really seem to be enough to keep it afloat when creating a peaceful universe.
The Terran trade stations consume hundreds of millions worth of production per hour. It might not be ship building but you can still make a ton of money selling to trade stations.
LameFox wrote:
Mon, 22. Nov 21, 02:58
Terraforming I have not tried, because even though I do not rush to end all my enemies as the OP did, there is no challenge that remains in the game once I have production sufficient to terraform. At that point there is no reason for me to continue so I start over.
Terraforming offers repeat projects where based on the planet's current population (which you control and can grow), you send down some huge amount of resources and they pay you some large sum of money.

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