PC hangs and thencrashes while gaming

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niccommander
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PC hangs and thencrashes while gaming

Post by niccommander » Tue, 24. May 22, 09:16

Hi,

while playing X4 my pc began to hang (sound and screen) and then only a hard-reset helps.
This often happens while in space, but not limited to - I currently have not identified a way to reproduce the problem, it just happens.
I think the problem started to occure some moths ago after and graphics-driver update (no guarantee that this is the real cause).
The game settings are still the same.

Info:
Game Version: newest (Build-ID: 8634178)
Game Lang: German
dx-diag: https://1drv.ms/t/s!AorWJDK5VBrrgtMQU6fLVns7_WtR7g
vulkaninfo: https://1drv.ms/t/s!AorWJDK5VBrrgtMRUk2pI__NFgNMnQ

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Re: PC hangs and thencrashes while gaming

Post by CBJ » Tue, 24. May 22, 09:52

If your whole PC freezes up then it can only be a driver or hardware issue, even if it only happens while running a particular game or other application.

Start with a clean graphics driver re-install, disabling your AMD sound device, and updating your Realtek drivers. You will also need to run things like memory tests, and check temperatures and voltages, to make sure your PC hasn't developed a hardware problem.

Imperial Good
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Re: PC hangs and thencrashes while gaming

Post by Imperial Good » Wed, 25. May 22, 00:40

Try updating your motherboard UEFI. I recall having a similar issue where randomly the whole system would freeze while gaming with my R9 3900X. This issue went away at some stage after updating the motherboard UEFI.

If operating your memory above 3200 mega transfers per second try lowering down to that value in case it is infinity fabric stability. If any part of your system is overclocked try reverting it. If you think it is graphics driver check for firmware updates for your GPU, update the graphic driver, and maybe even try forcing the graphics slot to a slower PCIe version in case there is some stability issues with it.

niccommander
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Re: PC hangs and thencrashes while gaming

Post by niccommander » Sat, 28. May 22, 23:21

Thanks for your answers :)

It looks like uninstalling the graphics driver with DDU followed by a reinstall helped.
In the last 6h of X4 I had only one reset - much better than about 5-10m after loading the savegame ;)

My MB-Firmware is already up to date.

As far as I know the only thing I "overclocked" is the memory, by using the XMP-Profiles.

Imperial Good
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Re: PC hangs and thencrashes while gaming

Post by Imperial Good » Sun, 29. May 22, 00:09

niccommander wrote:
Sat, 28. May 22, 23:21
As far as I know the only thing I "overclocked" is the memory, by using the XMP-Profiles.
This does not mean it will be stable. If using high transfer rate memory try lowering the transfer frequency to 3200 MHz (1600 MHz clock due to being DDR4 memory). If using 4 DIMMs you might want to try even lower than that so as to comply with stock guidelines.

As an example I installed 4x8 GB 3600 MHz memory into my R9 3900X. I was encountering random system reboots during playing games or even just browsing the internet. Dropping the memory frequency to 3200 MHz solved these, possibly showing that my infinity fabric is not stable at 1800 MHz with 4 DIMMs installed.

If this does help system stability then you can work from that to try and recover some of your memory performance by tuning values, if you want.

niccommander
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Re: PC hangs and thencrashes while gaming

Post by niccommander » Sun, 29. May 22, 10:34

So far X4 was the only program that crashed the PC.
I use this exact config for about 2 Jears now and had no problems until recent.
The selected XMP-Profile is already the 3200 one, so there should be no Problem.

I have dualboot and inside Linux everything works too (except games are not starting anymore somehow, but that's an different stoty)

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Re: PC hangs and thencrashes while gaming

Post by Imperial Good » Sun, 29. May 22, 10:40

If only X4 is crashing then it is likely due to the work profile that X4 has compared with other games you play. X4 generally pushes CPU harder than most games and as a result has been known to expose unstable CPU overclocks. It might even expose unstable stock configurations such as due to poor thermals, poor power regulation or even just silicon aging.

niccommander
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Re: PC hangs and thencrashes while gaming

Post by niccommander » Mon, 30. May 22, 20:14

I reduced the memory-speed to 3133, lets look if it fixes it.
And I remember I installed the second 16Gb kit last Year, so I have 4 populated Dims. Maybe thats the problem...

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Re: PC hangs and thencrashes while gaming

Post by niccommander » Thu, 2. Jun 22, 21:52

It seems you where right - 3133 still resulted in creashes but 2400 seems to work.

Thanks :)

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Re: PC hangs and thencrashes while gaming

Post by Terre » Fri, 3. Jun 22, 07:32

One of my Ryzen based system had stability issues, which I tracked to the memory, since upping the memory voltage, from 1.35v to 1.36v, things have been stable.

I bet that statement has just put the mouth on it.
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niccommander
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Re: PC hangs and thencrashes while gaming

Post by niccommander » Sun, 5. Jun 22, 19:38

Ok, 2400 worked for some time but I still had a crash - Im trying 1.36V with 3200 now

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Terre
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Re: PC hangs and thencrashes while gaming

Post by Terre » Sun, 5. Jun 22, 20:20

niccommander wrote:
Sun, 5. Jun 22, 19:38
Ok, 2400 worked for some time but I still had a crash - Im trying 1.36V with 3200 now
I forgot to say that my ram speed is 3600mhz@1.36v, with the timings set by DOCP.
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Re: PC hangs and thencrashes while gaming

Post by Imperial Good » Sun, 5. Jun 22, 23:33

I would be very careful blindly raising memory voltage. Older low binned DDR4 from Micron is known to fail very quickly if voltage is raised beyond what it is rated for. On the other hand Samsung B-die has been known to reach ~1.5V for extended periods without issues, assuming sufficient cooling.

As you are using a Zen 2 processor this could be instability within the CPU itself, such as infinity fabric or poor power regulation from motherboard VRMs. Slowing memory would have then helped by reducing the electrical and infinity fabric strain on the CPU. It could also be thermal related with the motherboard not receiving enough airflow to cool the components.

If you built this system yourself you could try re socketing the CPU in case it is a poor contact, do be careful removing it though due to how fragile the pins are. I would recommend watching some guides if you attempt this yourself. Main concern is the integrated heat spreader of the CPU package sticking to the heatsink.

To help test for CPU stability you could temporarily disable boosting by setting a non-100% clock speed limit in windows power management. This will make the CPU run slightly slower than base but should run cooler, use less power and at a lower frequency so generally be more stable. If the crashes goes away this would point towards what I mentioned above that it is CPU stability related.

niccommander
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Re: PC hangs and thencrashes while gaming

Post by niccommander » Mon, 13. Jun 22, 20:30

Another update:
3200 with 1.36V Worked most of the time, but there where still some crashes.

After looking at my MB-support-site manually I encountered, that there were several new BIOS versions and the newest was from this Year... The Version on my MB was from 2019...
The Asus bios update tool for Windows still said there was no update...
The next time I look manually first and do not trust such program ;)

After the update there was no crash so far - let's hope the best :)
As a bonus Resizable BAR is now also supported :)

niccommander
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Re: PC hangs and thencrashes while gaming

Post by niccommander » Tue, 14. Jun 22, 22:24

I just had a crash after changing some settings back (somehow they where reset):
  • enable FSR highest quality
  • enable medium FXAA
  • enable FreeSync
  • Change from Fullscreen to borderless Window
After disableing FSR and FXAA I had no crash so far.
I hope it stays this way.

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Re: PC hangs and thencrashes while gaming

Post by Imperial Good » Wed, 15. Jun 22, 01:09

niccommander wrote:
Tue, 14. Jun 22, 22:24
After disableing FSR and FXAA I had no crash so far.
FSR levels make the scene easier to render on the GPU. If you are not GPU bottlenecked then FSR will not alter CPU load.

FXAA is the opposite with levels increasing render workload. If you are GPU bottlenecked then it will reduce CPU load when enabled.

If CPU load has not been altered then this would point towards a GPU issue, or possibly power stability.

GPU could be tested by lowering power limit/target and effectively "underclocking" it. The lower power limit can lower operating temperature and place less strain on any PSU potentially improving stability.

Power stability should not be an issue if your PSU is from a vaguely reputable brand and reasonably rated but can be an issue if the PSU is cheap or under rated enough that it is struggling with its working conditions (poor ventilation, high ambient temperature, e.t.c.).

niccommander
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Re: PC hangs and thencrashes while gaming

Post by niccommander » Fri, 24. Jun 22, 19:42

Another Update:

It crashed serveral times again, setting ram voltage to 1.36V had no real effect.
It could really be a card (or driver) issue, since I'm getting more frequet crashes when I'm in the Station-Builder "Gamestart".
What I also observed: I have no crash If the game is running (Borderless Window, and SETA activated), but I have the focus on another window and do someting else.
This is obviously not the way of playing the game, but this works crash free for hours...

Maybe I have to invest in a new graphicscard :cry:

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Re: PC hangs and thencrashes while gaming

Post by Katorone » Fri, 24. Jun 22, 21:34

Make sure to do a RAM healthcheck as well. Though I'm not sure how to do this on windows.

The reasoning being that if the game runs in the background, its memory usage is fairly stable as well. Station designing can be very taxing on the pc.

niccommander
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Re: PC hangs and thencrashes while gaming

Post by niccommander » Sat, 25. Jun 22, 21:15

The problem seems to be Windows or a bad driver.

After fixing my graphicsdriver on Linux, so games can be started again, I played for about 8h nonstop (always foreground, but not always actively playing :wink: ) and had no crash so far :)

Playing on Linux is my favorite anyway, so I'm happy right now :)

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