Let's talk about 'Honor'

General discussion about X³: Farnham's Legacy.

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DanKara
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Let's talk about 'Honor'

Post by DanKara » Sun, 4. Sep 22, 08:49

Its been ages since I was able to get a ship to bail by chance and even longer on purpose. (Vanilla, 1.3)
... and I still need one for the 'Rare Blueprint Collector'.

So I dabbled a bit with the ScriptEditor to make that Honor-stat known to me.
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$test = get honour points
write to player logbook $test
I am currently at -251 ... that explains a lot, doesn't it? Not sure how that happened, but how to get back into neutral or positive values?


Since then I have asked a lot of military ships, trade ships and civil ships to either give up their ship or their cargo - mostly one time, but some I might have asked for multiple times (lost track). What I found seems like that:

- asking and getting shrugged of seems to have no impact on my honor stat
- asking and getting a hostile reaction might leed to a hostile TradeStation or CapShip (if same faction)... occassionaly my Honor was reduced further by -10, not sure if this relates but think so
- asking and getting some credits ejected seems to have no impact either - I collected the credits or not but left the target ship alone to dock, to leave the sector or leaving the sector myself ... according to some earlier post from CYCROW I expected differently...
- sadly no ship asked for freight ejected their cargo ... (honor depend too?)
- sadly no ship bailed, so I could not collect/return the pilot

- bought some used ships, collected and returned their former pilots and raised my honour stat - by a whooping +1

Has anyone more knowledge how best to raise 'Honor'?
Last edited by DanKara on Sun, 22. Oct 23, 08:09, edited 2 times in total.

v_make
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Re: Let's talk about 'Honour'

Post by v_make » Sun, 4. Sep 22, 20:14

I have not experienced this. But I know how to get pilots to be returned:
Buy second-hand ships in space, and the pilot will have a destination.
I think returning these pilots has the same effect as returing bailed ones.

Sorry I did not read till the end that you have tried the second-hand-ship pilots.

Well, if you want to cheat there are plenty of ways but that's hardly honorable :lol:
Regards.
Mark

DanKara
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Re: Let's talk about 'Honour'

Post by DanKara » Mon, 5. Sep 22, 08:12

v_make wrote:
Sun, 4. Sep 22, 20:14
Well, if you want to cheat there are plenty of ways but that's hardly honorable
With an Honor at -251 I have already revealed that I am not honorable :oops: (well, atleast as seen by this game).
But right now I'm still learning some of the new systems and features in X3FL, so I'm shying away from using "cheats" (but I am open for any 'how to' for an optional later use :mrgreen: ).

For now I need to know
- what causes my Honour to drop by -10's
- why can't I increase my Honor by letting ships go, that ejected some credits (or freight?) when asked.

Cycrow
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Re: Let's talk about 'Honor'

Post by Cycrow » Mon, 5. Sep 22, 11:17

You gain honour by returning bailed pilots. But you lose it if you kill/enslave those pilots or to continue to attack ships after they have given up credits/freight.

To make ships.bail when you have low honour you need to find pilots woth low morale (this is hidden however so you can't yell)

Getting the system override software would help to, if you jave it on board it will increase your chance of bailing.

Also don't keep spamming the surrender, this can lose you honour as well

DanKara
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Re: Let's talk about 'Honor'

Post by DanKara » Mon, 5. Sep 22, 12:46

Cycrow wrote:
Mon, 5. Sep 22, 11:17
To make ships.bail when you have low honour you need to find pilots woth low morale (this is hidden however so you can't yell)
That is were my current troubles started. For 'Rare' I just need to get that 'Milan Angreifer' (Kite Vanguard?). Tried many of them, they always have a morale above 20. Tried each of them with 'dozens' of reloads to no avail. Wasn't even aware of just how low my 'Honor' was (and than was taken aback... because in general I am not 'evil')
And yes, my player ship (M6) is fully equiped with all weapon slots filled and all software, including SOS and SES. The 'piracy software' I removed because I think thats breaking cargo bay shielding (?).
Cycrow wrote:
Mon, 5. Sep 22, 11:17
But you lose it if you kill/enslave those pilots or to continue to attack ships after they have given up credits/freight.
To the best of my knowledge I have never done such evil deeds in the past. Atleast not on purpose ... There may be a handfull of times when a pilot jumped ship in the last possible moment..
In my current 'test' I have not fired a single shot and asked each single ship once or twice (thrice at max) yet lost honor in multiple steps (of -10) down to -291. Is that 'spamming' or is asking many different ships in the same sector considered as 'spamming'? I will take it as 'yes', it might better explain my losses by multiple -10's in my 'test' than the local TradeStation becoming hostile (as this was not persistant).


In this post you said, that returning pilots is the 'best way' to increase honor but letting them leave also increases honor.
I have seen my honor increased by +1 per returned pilot and have seen no increase when letting them leave ... and to be honest a '+1' is the best option?

Would you please be so kind and disclose some more details on how the related scripts work (or are supposed to work)?

iXenon
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Re: Let's talk about 'Honor'

Post by iXenon » Mon, 5. Sep 22, 19:18

DanKara wrote:
Mon, 5. Sep 22, 12:46
Cycrow wrote:
Mon, 5. Sep 22, 11:17
But you lose it if you kill/enslave those pilots or to continue to attack ships after they have given up credits/freight.
To the best of my knowledge I have never done such evil deeds in the past. Atleast not on purpose ... There may be a handfull of times when a pilot jumped ship in the last possible moment..
You can take a look at "Advanced spacesuit" and "Spacesuit" entries in pilot stats to check if you have pilots and marines killed in past.

DanKara
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Re: Let's talk about 'Honor'

Post by DanKara » Mon, 5. Sep 22, 19:53

iXenon wrote:
Mon, 5. Sep 22, 19:18
You can take a look at "Advanced spacesuit" and "Spacesuit" entries in pilot stats to check if you have pilots and marines killed in past.
Good point. Just checked. According to my list of destroyed objects I have killed 11 Spacesuits but no pilots, marines or advanced spacesuits.

Cycrow
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Re: Let's talk about 'Honor'

Post by Cycrow » Mon, 5. Sep 22, 20:10

You should gain 1 point for returning a pilot to their destination, lose 1 point if you enslave them, or 2 points if you just kill them.

also lose 1 point if you kill the ship after getting freight. Leaving them alone is 0 points, but it saves you from losing any.

low honour is upto a 20% reduced chance. The base chance being upto 30% based on morale. So a ship with a morale of 10 would be a 0% base chance.

this can be increased with SOS, low hull and better weapons/shields. But also reduced based on the number of attempts. The best way to get a bail is to quickly drop the ship below 10% hull and comm surrender

Hwitvlf
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Re: Let's talk about 'Honor'

Post by Hwitvlf » Fri, 9. Sep 22, 01:12

Glad to know this info. Cool mechanic added to the mix! The max base chance of 30% doesn't seem to match the bail rate in my game, but I wonder if asking for surrender gives a second 'roll' at the 30% chance. As a matter of roleplay, I always try to ask for surrender before destroying a ship and drop most bailed pilots off at their destinations. The two times I have measured it, I get around a 50% bail rate.

I do used bailed pilots for marines. I wonder if that count's as 'enslaving'.

Sovereign01
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Re: Let's talk about 'Honor'

Post by Sovereign01 » Sat, 10. Sep 22, 19:54

On a related note, I managed to get the 'surrender' achievement today. There was a TS I wanted to get the last Atreus ship and I didn't want to spend 2 more agents building the notoriety needed to get it when I'd got their other ships. The normal method wasn't going to cut it against an armoured TS so I shredded its hull to almost nothing with mass drivers first. I had to order my M6 to follow the ship then controlled one of the turrets manually because it couldn't equip them, then order the Atreus ship to surrender.

delray
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Re: Let's talk about 'Honor'

Post by delray » Fri, 10. Mar 23, 18:59

Image

As shown above (where I go from -3 to +8 honor), releasing captured astronauts in the Goner Temple also improves the Honor value. You don't have to ferry them to their destinations, just capture them and when they start taking up too much space, hand them over to the Goners.
Where is it?

iXenon
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Re: Let's talk about 'Honor'

Post by iXenon » Fri, 10. Mar 23, 23:54

delray wrote:
Fri, 10. Mar 23, 18:59
You don't have to ferry them to their destinations, just capture them and when they start taking up too much space, hand them over to the Goners.
Yes, you don't, but they sometimes offer 300k+ for that small favor. But it's good to know that's it's possible to release astronauts there. I thought it works only for slaves.

DanKara
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Re: Let's talk about 'Honor'

Post by DanKara » Sat, 11. Mar 23, 02:28

delray wrote:
Fri, 10. Mar 23, 18:59
As shown above (where I go from -3 to +8 honor), releasing captured astronauts in the Goner Temple also improves the Honor value.
How many SLAVES did you release at the tempel to get from -3 to +8 in Moral?

I think, I have seen the increasement of +1 per released slave .... but back at the time I hadn't thought of (mass-)buying slaves and releasing them at the Goner Temple (even one-by-one that would have been much faster than ferrying spaced pilots back 'home').

delray
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Re: Let's talk about 'Honor'

Post by delray » Sat, 11. Mar 23, 09:52

Image
( https://i.imgur.com/SmEMFjw.png )

600 slaves doesn't do much for the Honor, doesn't do anything at all IMO. I have fully updated the game + unofficial patch.

I think best one can do is always buy used ships that are offered out in the space, deliver their pilots (who jump out after you've bought the ship) to the Goners.
Where is it?

vincele
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Re: Let's talk about 'Honor'

Post by vincele » Sat, 21. Oct 23, 14:00

I'm trying to understand why I don't get bails, and I think the script in post #1 is not the right one.

Here is what I used:
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$test = get honour points
write to player logbook $test
return null
I can confirm that the script output goes up by one if I buy a second hand ship, grab the pilot onboard my TP, have a look at its details in my freight bay and then deliver him to his chosen destination station.

BTW, that's my first script editor use, it's cool to have it...

DanKara
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Re: Let's talk about 'Honor'

Post by DanKara » Sun, 22. Oct 23, 08:07

vincele wrote:
Sat, 21. Oct 23, 14:00
I'm trying to understand why I don't get bails, and I think the script in post #1 is not the right one.
BTW, that's my first script editor use, it's cool to have it...
True on first and very true on second point.
Made that script in the first place for the (absolute) trade-rank-value at a time my percentages wouldn't move any more.
Typical stupid me by messing up and posting wrong...

BrigandPhantos77
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Re: Let's talk about 'Honor'

Post by BrigandPhantos77 » Tue, 24. Oct 23, 03:18

DanKara wrote:
Sun, 22. Oct 23, 08:07
vincele wrote:
Sat, 21. Oct 23, 14:00
I'm trying to understand why I don't get bails, and I think the script in post #1 is not the right one.
BTW, that's my first script editor use, it's cool to have it...
True on first and very true on second point.
Made that script in the first place for the (absolute) trade-rank-value at a time my percentages wouldn't move any more.
Typical stupid me by messing up and posting wrong...
Don't feel bad. Mine's 492 and I still have an issue getting bails with ships I want/need for there blueprint. I'm missing the Teladi Kite Vanguard. Only 2 roaming about and Neither will bail. Best to get your marines (going forward) from the black market. :mrgreen:
Peace is a state of mind!
War is absolute!
~ Phantos ~

OrionTaltos
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Re: Let's talk about 'Honor'

Post by OrionTaltos » Tue, 24. Oct 23, 21:58

My honor is at 48 and I get a pretty healthy amount of bails.

Actually, I miss quite a few because they take too long to bail. It'd be better if they bailed and then radioed their message about it. Those Tempests keep going until that ship registers as non-hostile and I can't always disable the turrets :oops:

Most commonly, I've been running a Carrack with Plasma Beam Cannons and System Override Software. I get lots of tiny hits which seems to helpful for finding that threshold for fighter or freighter pilots to decide they're not that brave. Pilots I pick up usually go to the Goner Temple unless they're worth quite a bit or they are skilled enough to become a Universal Trader :mrgreen:
Arrow + Auto-Pillok + SETA = White Knuckle Terror

DanKara
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Re: Let's talk about 'Honor'

Post by DanKara » Wed, 25. Oct 23, 07:18

BrigandPhantos77 wrote:
Tue, 24. Oct 23, 03:18
Don't feel bad. Mine's 492 and I still have an issue getting bails with ships I want/need for there blueprint. I'm missing the Teladi Kite Vanguard.
Kite Vanguard? That situation sounds familiar :mrgreen: (Look at my post from Mo, 5. Sep 22, 12:46 in this thread).


A year ago I tested with cheated honour stats (modified and vanilla). It seemed a honour around 50 is the sweet spot for getting bails through talking or firing. Increasing my honour to +100 or above did not increase my bailing success - in fact those values felt as bad as my starting -251... Maybe there is cap or some kind of stack overflow with reversal effect...

BrigandPhantos77
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Re: Let's talk about 'Honor'

Post by BrigandPhantos77 » Wed, 25. Oct 23, 11:38

DanKara wrote:
Wed, 25. Oct 23, 07:18
BrigandPhantos77 wrote:
Tue, 24. Oct 23, 03:18
Don't feel bad. Mine's 492 and I still have an issue getting bails with ships I want/need for there blueprint. I'm missing the Teladi Kite Vanguard.
Kite Vanguard? That situation sounds familiar :mrgreen: (Look at my post from Mo, 5. Sep 22, 12:46 in this thread).


A year ago I tested with cheated honour stats (modified and vanilla). It seemed a honour around 50 is the sweet spot for getting bails through talking or firing. Increasing my honour to +100 or above did not increase my bailing success - in fact those values felt as bad as my starting -251... Maybe there is cap or some kind of stack overflow with reversal effect...
I get decent bails in other places. When I engage Xenon groups, it's not uncommon for me to get 6 or 7 bails out of 20 possible's. Lately I've been letting them run rough-shot over the commonwealth. Trying to protect notorieties from dropping hard in a few places. Course, I purchase a lot of used ships and return the pilots. I'm well into the hundreds of used ships. It's a great way to make credits too. When I fight the strong arms, I get on average 3 to 5 bails per group.

I might try enslaving a few and lowering the stat to see if that helps. But only 2 of the Kite Vanguards makes it a difficult quest. I've got max rep with Teladi, and don't wanna damage it too badly. Those 2 probably have a moral of 10.
Peace is a state of mind!
War is absolute!
~ Phantos ~

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