Russia-Ukraine War

[felter]

BTW, to all trolls who say sanctions don't work - if it's true then why Russia went to beg Iran for drones? Now they are talking with North Korea for military supply.
Yep, it must be definetly all fine in Russia.

Where can I read about this? So far there was no evidence of either Iranian drones or Korean (or other countries' for that matter, not even that of Belarus) forces on the battlefields.

Quite surprised you missed this one, as it was all over the press at the time as Putin personally went to Iran to beg for help and that's something he doesn't do very often for obvious reasons, he is scared of being assassinated as that’s what he does to people, assassinate them while their outside of Russia, and he is scared that something will happen while he is away from Russia, like the saying goes, when the cats away the mice will play.

The other issue with sanctions is a lot of them are just starting to come into effect, so saying they do not work or do work is still a little bit premature but what sanctions are already in effect have rattled them, you just have to remember a short while ago Russia went ape because shipments had been stopped due to sanctions. I think it was from Kaliningrad by rail, and it was Poland that stopped the trains due to sanctions, but I may be wrong on that, and I can't be bothered looking it up.

[fiksal]

maybe the river of blood makes people think twice.

one that many Russians support. And not just Russians


at the end it's only for the better

Rivers of blood is what you want to see. Yeah, I figured as much.

every sane person looks and sees it.

apologists are no different from the fascist types that do it, in their thinking

[clakclak]

[...]
Earlier I said no one in his/her mind would dare shelling a nuclear power plant. Well…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PHiFNWJXWgI
Either Ukraine leaders are not of this world, or… (and no, Russia self-shelling the plant "just because it is EVIL and wants to commit suicide in the most brutal painful and convoluted way possible" is not an explanation to this shelling).
[...]

That link in your comment goes to a video about the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles. I am assuming this was an accident and you wanted to link another source.

[Alm888]

[...]
Earlier I said no one in his/her mind would dare shelling a nuclear power plant. Well…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PHiFNWJXWgI
Either Ukraine leaders are not of this world, or… (and no, Russia self-shelling the plant "just because it is EVIL and wants to commit suicide in the most brutal painful and convoluted way possible" is not an explanation to this shelling).
[...]

That link in your comment goes to a video about the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles. I am assuming this was an accident and you wanted to link another source.

Oh, my bad!
This happens when you manage several conversations at once.
Here is what I intended to show.

[Sovereign01]

[...]
Earlier I said no one in his/her mind would dare shelling a nuclear power plant. Well…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PHiFNWJXWgI
Either Ukraine leaders are not of this world, or… (and no, Russia self-shelling the plant "just because it is EVIL and wants to commit suicide in the most brutal painful and convoluted way possible" is not an explanation to this shelling).
[...]

That link in your comment goes to a video about the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles. I am assuming this was an accident and you wanted to link another source.

Oh, my bad!
This happens when you manage several conversations at once.
Here is what I intended to show.

You're doing it wrong, everyone knows this is the video you're supposed to link to!

And somewhere out there is a TMNT fan wondering why he's looking at a video for the war in Ukraine

[JSDD]

Doubts are also mounting regarding the European appetite for economic sacrifice. “Do we want to have peace, or do we want to have the air conditioning on?” Italy’s Prime Minister Mario Draghi queried in April.

Apparently, it’s the latter.

https://www.politico.eu/article/the-gre ... russia-gas


in the not too far distant future (that means in winter), europeans gonna ask the opposite question namely:

"Do we want to have peace (in a foreign country), or do we want the heating on and warm water available?"
// i suppose i'll be the latter, again ...

but Zelenskyy added that even those who have fled Russia due to their opposition to the war shouldn’t be exempt from this ban. “Whichever kind of Russian . . . make them go to Russia,” he said, arguing all citizens shoulder some blame for Putin’s war.

https://www.politico.eu/article/russia- ... -visa-ban/


i wonder if this ukrainian nazi has ever heard the term "sippenhaft" (engl.: "collective punishment")
why dont we put all russian nationals in labour camps and let them "work off" the pain and suffering the russian government has caused ??
wouldn't that be a great idea ? .. to see people being punished for the errors of others ??

just let us go 1 step further (with this "reasoning"):
why dont we put all jews into labour camps and let them "work off" the pain their government causes in palestine?
// the necessary infrastructure is already there ...


but .. hey, lets stop here ... (is what my colleague "vertigo7" would state, i assume)
thats "what-about-ism" by definition ... asking the question "what about those / her / him .." even if they do not have anything to do with the problem ^^

[felter]

I'm just curious, you do understand the word Nazi and all the implications that go with it. To be honest, if I was to look at words and actions I would say that Putin is probably the closer to being a Nazi than Zelenskyy, especially when you look at the fact he is imprisoning those that do speak up against him, even if they are Russians, he isn't adversed to murdering opponents, even if that means killing innocents in the process of doing so. I don't remember anyone saying Zelenskyy has done anything like those things. Plus, you also have to remember that Russia are the invading nation on Putin's command, it's not Ukraine that is invading Russia on behalf of Zelensky. Not to even mention that Zelenskyy is a practising Jew, and I doubt very much that there are too many Jewish Nazis on this planet. But hey, if you want to fantasize that Zelenskyy is a Jewish Nazi knock yourself out, but it doesn't really make you look good.

[mr.WHO]

"Do we want to have peace (in a foreign country), or do we want the heating on and warm water available?"
// i suppose i'll be the latter, again ...

I'd like to break your (and Putins') little bubble, but no one in Europe gonna freeze or have cold water - most of countries, including Germany have some contingency plans and alternative sources to survive the winter. It's no longer life & death situation, but more like life & temporary inconvinience for a year or two.

Guess what, tuning heating or AC a few degree is not a worlds end.
Neither shutting down some non-essential lighting and electricity.
German industry might be f*cked for longer, but that's the matter for German electorate to purge politicians who put them in this clusterf*ck.

All that Putin blackmail is doing is to speed up detaching European Economy from Russia and ruining any arguments for Putin bootlickers in Europe.
Keep up the good work! At this pace, next year Russia reputation will be the North Korea of Europe.

BTW, first long therm weather projection seems to indicate the winter in Europe will be as warm as previous year, so even nature screw Putin plans.

[Tamina]

They are already voted out. It is funny though, how the (responsible) right wing is blaming the current leftish gov right now.

They still believe that Putin is going to send gas through NS2 if they turn it on. They really like to be Putins dog.

[fiksal]

Plus, you also have to remember that Russia are the invading nation on Putin's command, it's not Ukraine that is invading Russia on behalf of Zelensky. Not to even mention that Zelenskyy is a practising Jew, and I doubt very much that there are too many Jewish Nazis on this planet. But hey, if you want to fantasize that Zelenskyy is a Jewish Nazi knock yourself out, but it doesn't really make you look good.

it'd be good for jsdd for one week to explore all Russian's war crimes. He agrees that the Russian government is fascist but never commented on why, - so exploring what makes them so is another good thing.

Drop the Russian propaganda fantasies.

At least for one week. Start posting about the war crimes, the destruction, the refugees, and how Russians say that everything is according to plan.


Is this likely?

[Sovereign01]

Zelenskyy accuses Russia of 'nuclear blackmail' after shelling at Europe's largest power plant.

President Volodymyr Zelenskyy has accused Russia of "nuclear blackmail" warning its troops are continuing to shell a nuclear power plant as a cover for their attacks on nearby towns.

In an evening video address, the Ukrainian president called on the international community to impose new sanctions on Moscow in response to its troops' actions on the Zaporizhzhia nuclear power plant, in the Russian-controlled city of Enerhodar, in southern Ukraine.

Both Russian and Ukrainian officials traded accusations about renewed shelling of the plant, with each side alleging the other was responsible for the attacks that have raised fears of a potential radiation leak due to the fighting.

Mr Zelenskyy warned that the presence of Russian forces around Europe's largest nuclear power plant threatened a catastrophe for the entire continent and beyond.

"All Russian forces must immediately withdraw from the station and neighbouring areas without any conditions," Mr Zelenskyy said in his address.

"Any radiation incident at the Zaporizhia nuclear power plant could be a blow to the countries of the European Union, and to Turkey, and to Georgia, and countries from more distant regions," he added.

"Everything depends only on the direction and strength of the wind. If Russia's actions lead to a catastrophe, the consequences may hit those who remain silent so far."

The president called on the international community to protect the plant and if it lacks the "strength and determination" to do so, the "world will lose".

"It loses to terrorists, yielding to nuclear blackmail. And this may be a precedent that other terrorists will see. There is still a chance to prevent this loss," he said.

The press office of the Kremlin-backed administration in Enerhodar told Russian Interfax news agency that Ukrainian forces were carrying out “massive shelling” on the facility, as well as on Enerhodar’s residential and industrial areas.

It claimed the shelling came from nearby Nikopol, a Ukrainian-held city which faces the plant across the Dnieper River.

But the mayor of Nikopol later said the Russians themselves were the ones shelling Enerhodar.

Mayor Yevhen Yevtushenko and other municipal authorities in Nikopol have repeatedly accused Russian troops stationed at the plant of shelling the city, knowing that Ukrainian forces there were unlikely to fire back.

Might have something to do with the presence of Russian units on site.

[felter]

There has also been another ammunition supply depot in Crimea that has gone BOOM, initially Russia said it was caused by another fire but has since said it was sabotage. Looks like things in Crimea are getting interesting, and it is no longer a safe destination for Russian tourists.

[jlehtone]

Doubts are also mounting regarding the European appetite for economic sacrifice. “Do we want to have peace, or do we want to have the air conditioning on?” Italy’s Prime Minister Mario Draghi queried in April.

Apparently, it’s the latter.

https://www.politico.eu/article/the-gre ... russia-gas

in the not too far distant future (that means in winter), europeans gonna ask the opposite question namely:

"Do we want to have peace (in a foreign country), or do we want the heating on and warm water available?"
// i suppose i'll be the latter, again ...

Those questions seem to have "A or B" form, like the A and B were mutually exclusive.
Surely we could get warm water even if there were peace. Hence, not mutually exclusive.

Does that mean that the question actually is:
Do we want Russia out of Ukraine because we want there to be peace,
or do we rather want Russia out of Ukraine because that allows comfort for us?

[Sovereign01]

Putin seems to be banking on the increased energy prices to undermine domestic support in the west for supporting Ukraine, however, even if the war ended tomorrow there's no way energy prices are going to magically drop to pre-war levels. Germany's knee-jerk response to Fukushima by shutting down all their nuclear reactors notwithstanding.

[clakclak]

[...]

but Zelenskyy added that even those who have fled Russia due to their opposition to the war shouldn’t be exempt from this ban. “Whichever kind of Russian . . . make them go to Russia,” he said, arguing all citizens shoulder some blame for Putin’s war.

https://www.politico.eu/article/russia- ... -visa-ban/


i wonder if this ukrainian nazi has ever heard the term "sippenhaft" (engl.: "collective punishment")
[...]

Calling Zelensky, a jew, a Nazi is an interesting way of downplaying the crimes of the Nazis. Especially give your suggestion of putting jews into labour camps a few lines after that. Is this really the way in which we want to discuss here? While you are allready throwing around German terms, may I remind you of the term "Täter-Oper Umkehr" (roughly translates to victim blaming)?

EDIT: Yes, I know the context you made the comment about the camps, but still, it is in pretty bad taste.

[Vertigo 7]

[...]

but Zelenskyy added that even those who have fled Russia due to their opposition to the war shouldn’t be exempt from this ban. “Whichever kind of Russian . . . make them go to Russia,” he said, arguing all citizens shoulder some blame for Putin’s war.

https://www.politico.eu/article/russia- ... -visa-ban/


i wonder if this ukrainian nazi has ever heard the term "sippenhaft" (engl.: "collective punishment")
[...]

Calling Zelensky, a jew, a Nazi is an interesting way of downplaying the crimes of the Nazis. Especially give your suggestion of putting jews into labour camps a few lines after that. Is this really the way in which we want to discuss here? While you are allready throwing around German terms, may I remind you of the term "Täter-Oper Umkehr" (roughly translates to victim blaming)?

It's typical of actual Nazis and fascists to try to call others a Nazi to distract from their own failings and ineptitudes. We see this all the time from members of the GOP and of course, Putin and his fan bois. Largely its because that's all they can do since they know facts aren't on their side and they're used to idiots being the ones that believe what they say.

[burger1]

Chinese troops will travel to Russia to take part in joint military exercises led by the host and including India, Belarus, Mongolia, Tajikistan and other countries, China's defence ministry said on Wednesday.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/chin ... -rcna43460

Might be a transfer of weapons, etc....? Equipment left behind?

[JSDD]

Calling Zelensky, a jew, a Nazi is an interesting way of downplaying the crimes of the Nazis.

... i'm not downplaying any thing or any crime, that not my intention
my intention was to point out that kind of "attitude" against 150 million innocent russians, to make them pay for something they didnt cause
zelensky is getting more and more desperate (and hence: full of hatred of russians) which makes him propose populistic and idiotic ideas, just to "harm" the bad russians
same thing happened every time before any pogrom (be it against the jews or any other group) ...

zelenskis attitude to russians is the kind of attitude hitler had to the jews ...
(the difference being that zelenski has not the power to overrrun half of europe. if that'd be the case, we'd have seen "reverse-butchas" in every street corner in russia)
(putin doesnt have this toxic attitude against others, for example)

Especially give your suggestion of putting jews into labour camps a few lines after that.

cause everybody knows what that means, it is kind of a definition of unjust treatment, it is just "outrageous"
just as outrageous as trumps policies to bann 7 muslim nationals to come to the US ...
and the same thing is true for the current "anti-russian visa ban"

But not only is this antithetical to classic liberal values, which frown upon targeting an entire ethnic or political group for the actions of a few, collective punishment is also specifically prohibited by treaty in both international and non-international armed conflicts — notably in Article 3 and additional protocols of the Geneva Conventions.

https://www.politico.eu/article/russia- ... -visa-ban/

EDIT: Yes, I know the context you made the comment about the camps, but still, it is in pretty bad taste.

i know that its a bit "provocative" ... sorry
but on the other hand, it gets peoples attention ^^
and makes them actually think about these "fighting words" .. at least a little bit ..

https://youtu.be/5ju4Gla2odw?t=104


but all those formalities aside ...
zelenski is a #-0x-ing racist, he doesnt need to have blonde hair and blue eyes to convince me (at least)

[fiksal]

that's your most important issue?


I am going to sit that one out as a Russian

[jlehtone]

(putin doesnt have this toxic attitude against others, for example)

Oh yes, his people merely hint that they will make pre-emptive nuclear strikes as counter to all countries that "have started a war against Russia" (and the list of those "hostile countries" is not short).