The state of American democracy - 1 hour video

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Alan Phipps
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Re: The state of American democracy - 1 hour video

Post by Alan Phipps » Sat, 29. Jan 22, 16:59

It's of some idle interest to me as to how you might consider this particular forum then. I see it as a place where people who share at least one common interest (and perhaps sometimes *only* the one) get to question and debate various topical issues. Isn't that a sort of social media? Certainly I found this forum to be a useful distraction and even sometimes an inspiration over lockdowns.

Sometimes issues here are debated heatedly or contested at extreme length and level of detail and, yes, sometimes there are posts with content or posting style that make my toes curl. However, even then, I still tend to ask myself whether they may have points that could be valid and question any related preconceptions that I may hold. If I didn't think about it and just flamed them because it didn't agree with my personal comfort zone beliefs, then I could indeed be 'part of the problem'. Hence I don't think that you can divorce the media, the content and the consumer base and just pick and choose which aspect to blame in the main.

Hmm, now how was that supposed to be about American democracy? :D
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Re: The state of American democracy - 1 hour video

Post by matthewfarmery » Thu, 10. Feb 22, 14:33

I had to post this, as it sheds new light into the depths that Trump has gone to to seize the 2020 election.

first off, Trump torn up multiple pages of documents that he didn't want to hand over to the national archives, as well as shredding (by hand) any documents that he claimed was too sensitive to keep. (confirmed by various sources)

Also on top of that, he has bunged the WH loo with even more pages of sensitive documents, when Trump's aids kept on bringing back torn pages that were taped up.

And now, even worse, Trump took with him 15 boxes of highly sensitive documents to his home. (those boxes have been handed over, and now in the hands of the 6/1 committee.

Some of those documents shed new light in what Trump was planning to overturn the election. Trying to seize voting machines, using lawyers to claim that the election was rigged and so on.

The above is illegal, and this was enforced into law after Nixon tried to hide records.

Still, this madman, still walks free. But as new light is coming out about his time in the WH, it really shows how bad things got there. And why he should never be president again.

More on this story.

https://edition.cnn.com/2022/02/10/poli ... index.html

This is a true test of American democracy. And if America will continue to have one. If this happens again, America will not have a democracy to speak of. As a dictator will rule instead. The problem is the republican party. As they helped enable Trump, even those like Mitch McConnell are now saying they no longer want Trump, but they still need Trump's MAGA base / cult. And that is wht they are now classed as, a cult. And they have a strong voice.

In that respect, the republicans are powerless to remove Trump, unless they anger this base, but if they don't do something, another Trump will happen. and the democrats will have failed to do something while they still had time.

The real question is, will anyone have the balls to go after Trump? I don't know, even though there are multiple investigations, but if they have the balls to bring down this powerful and corrupt figure remains to be seen.

And the clock is very much against them.
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felter
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Re: The state of American democracy - 1 hour video

Post by felter » Thu, 10. Feb 22, 15:56

I haven't watched the OP's video or been following this thread, so I don't know if this has already been said or not.

You do all know that America isn't even classed as a full Democracy any more, it is called a flawed Democracy and has held that title since Trump took over as president. By the way that is just coincidence, even if he hadn't become President, America would still have become a flawed Democracy, he just didn't help matters. Also, to show you the kind of reasons why they have become a flawed Democracy when one of the countries Politicians was asked about the concern that America was no longer classed as a Full Democracy, the idiot replied that's because we are a Republic not a democracy.

The UK itself is still classed as full Democracy, but guess what currently due to the happenings over the past few years, since Bozo the Clown took office the UK is now also on the verge of also becoming a flawed Democracy, as its Democratic score has gone from 8.54 last year to it currently sitting at 8.10. This means that countries Taiwan, Uruguay, Mauritius and Costa Rica have a higher Democratic classification than the UK currently has. The difference between the US and the UK is that at the end of the day, the current UK classification is down to one person, and that's Boris (Bozo) Johnson.
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Re: The state of American democracy - 1 hour video

Post by matthewfarmery » Fri, 11. Feb 22, 12:58

Barbara Walter, a University of California professor and an expert on civil conflicts, recently wrote about the political volatility in the U.S. since the Jan. 6 insurrection, which dropped the country into the anocracy zone, and she told CNN the riot had made the deadly risks from Donald Trump's lies "impossible to deny and ignore."

"Anocracies are neither fully democratic nor fully autocratic; their citizens enjoy some elements of democratic rule (e.g., elections), while other rights (e.g., due process or freedom of the press) suffer," Walter wrote for the Washington Post. "In the last weeks of Donald Trump’s presidency, the respected Center for Systemic Peace (CSP) calculated that, for the first time in more than two centuries, the United States no longer qualified as a democracy. It had, over the preceding five years, become an anocracy."
I posted that on page 2, the link to the main article is also there. So yes, the US democracy has fallen a few rankings, but judging from the above response, its not even a democracy any more. (failed or otherwise) With one party wanting total power, and willing to turn a blind eye to a madman. His cult been strong, and this party can't ignore them, or get rid of them, as this party fears the repercussions if they did.

But yes, America can no longer pride itself on its democracy. And your probably right about the UK as well. without the bozo, there are very few options on who will replace him. And if the UK goes into a general election, I doubt Labour will win. as for the other parties, not a chance. So we are also stuck with this bozo. Not a good time.
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Re: The state of American democracy - 1 hour video

Post by humility925 » Tue, 15. Mar 22, 06:05

democracy are highly vulnerable to corruption, person could speaking as false promise, very charming, but secret oppression or not act on promise or meaning difference than what people/voter think, I myself live in American, and I don't trust Democracy, but any government form as well because based of humankind/men are often self interest and not for people's interest even calm to be. Right now, it's so many law, policy, fee, tax, living cost is high while wage is not reasonable to covered living cost like used to be long time ago (Min wage could afford new house and new car in 1950 (but not those day). Democracy keep saying yet nothing changed (in good way, improved way, not worse or bad change) for long time.

Unfortunately, people are so easy deceived by those person who seek higher rank of career, speaking gave what they want to heard but not action on solution for many years, even few or some throw money on problem but not fix problem that cause (like law, policy that drive people to homeless in first place, ect in all while milk common citizen/people's time and money dry while deceived or one are not deceived but powerless to do anything. If anything Democracy is very threat to people, especially rich, charming, seem like smart and clever but heart is rotten and too corruption that people didn't know or noticed it at all.

Don't get me wrong, all other form of government are corruption too, it's just democracy is more and higher vulnerable to corruption in long terms. Problem is that it's who and what kind of people running in the power like government and corporation.
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Re: The state of American democracy - 1 hour video

Post by Falcrack » Tue, 15. Mar 22, 16:05

A democracy is only as good as its citizens. That is both the main strength, and the main weakness, of democracy.

That said, I would not have it any other way.

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Re: The state of American democracy - 1 hour video

Post by matthewfarmery » Tue, 15. Mar 22, 17:06

This I think is the biggest problem facing America, some parts of the country seem to want a downfall of democracy. Also some of the new channels like Fox news isn't helping matters.

Right now, I feel that American democracy is at a knifes edge and it could very easy fail. How much of Americas still wants a democracy really depends on American citizens themselves. But if they allow that two timed impeached president back in, then democracy will fail. As he wanting the ability to fire any excitative branch official if he comes back into power. He certainly been touting he might run for office. But then he might also be breaking some laws as well, (mainly funding)

At the end of the day, I still hope America doesn't fall down in that deep hole, once there, it will be impossible for it to climb out of.

And with heightened tensions else where in the world, that is the last thing this planet needs is a failed democracy from a western world.

I guess time will tell.
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