[X3LU] Mayhem 3.21b

[Hairless-Ape]

Really loving 3.16 and must thank you for the new features. Very nice so far.

Looking at the New Features of 3.17 however, I have to be the lone voice of opposition though. This isn't so much a list of new features, but appears much more like a nerf in some key ways.

I can swallow the new "engine" concept, although I've yet to truly see why it's needed, and also think it overrides the ability to tweek individual ships, which some of us do using X3 Editor.. I guess I'll have to dive in once again and figure out what you did for this so I can tweek certain ships to my liking. Given few people do this, it's likely not something you need to consider, but thought I'd put it out there.

I can't swallow the removal of the variants (Hauler, enhanced, etc..). Capturing variants and flying them around myself was a major part of the joy of the game, which is already nerfed heavily in terms of what ships I can build. I think they were removed because it takes time to edit them using the new "engine" system added in this release, and so they were just simply removed. Having ship variations like this, along with an historically complete list of ships I can build for my race (also nerfed long ago), is really important. Exploring space and exploring all the variations of flyable ships is a major part of the fun. I hope you will consider expanding this rather than removing ships. Please.

I'm unclear about the "People requirement crafting cost". Does that mean when you build a Forsei, that 90 people simply disappear from that outpost and are consumed when you build one? Seems vastly higher than the previous crew requirements.

Love the New space weed perk. Love the 3 jump beacons in first TL. Really miss the Marine perk and boarding marines to capture ships. That was a huge loss also and far more fun than hacking.
Not sure if I'll go to 3.17 as the nerf seems bigger than the new features Perhaps you'll consider adding some back in. Sorry to be a pain in your side. love your work and your vision as it's really, in the end, a joy to play.

[jimbo1282019]

any chance i could download the 3.16 version im not wanting the latest

thanks

[Hairless-Ape]

3.16
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1ibuIuV ... sp=sharing

[jimbo1282019]

thanks! i appreciate it, just wish Joubarbe would upload the new versions without overwriting the older versions as some of the changes could be questionable or maybe not in tune with the way somebody is playing the game ie darth fiscus when he did his rebalance mod during his playthrough either way thanks for the 3.16 ver

[alexalsp]

any chance i could download the 3.16 version im not wanting the latest

thanks

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/ ... sp=sharing

[Joubarbe]

@Hairless-Ape: Thank you for your suggestions. 3.17 is a first pass, and I now intend to reintroduce ship variations, but not all of them, and in a more consistent way. The variants will be as follow:

- Hauler: more cargo.
- Raider: faster.
- Vanguard: better shield regeneration.
- Sentinel: stronger hull.
- Advanced: cheaper, lower maintenance costs, reduced crew. Always have the "high research cost" modifier.

There's currently a bug in the cargo size calculations of some ships. It will be fixed. M5 and M4 will also be cheaper.

[arkcheung]

Actually I like 3.17 but my only concern is the balance. In previous version M2 ship is all I have to build and it kills any other ship easily. I really like to see how the weapon/equipment affects the ship's capability like in EVE. Big ships with big/slow guns should not be able to easily hit small and fast ship. Few small ships may not harm the big ships in any ways but with sworms of small ships there is a still chance that the big fish can be eaten by small fish. But in current game small ship can't even get closer to the big ship.

[arkcheung]

Few more suggestion regarding the research:

-NO Research Station limited to be only one in each sector. The player should be able to fill up a sector with only research stations to max the research bonus.
-When the game started the player should be only able to research the ships of the game start Faction. All the other faction's ship can not be researched till the player captured one and have it recycled (physically researched in other words). That would be more fun and challenging. In current games player just pick the best ship among all the factions and some of the ships will never ever be researched or built.

[alexalsp]

The idea is good, but not for everyone.

[jimbo1282019]

Few more suggestion regarding the research:

-NO Research Station limited to be only one in each sector. The player should be able to fill up a sector with only research stations to max the research bonus.
-When the game started the player should be only able to research the ships of the game start Faction. All the other faction's ship can not be researched till the player captured one and have it recycled (physically researched in other words). That would be more fun and challenging. In current games player just pick the best ship among all the factions and some of the ships will never ever be researched or built.

i completely agree with this, being able to research all ships is a big game unbalance if you ask me what should be done is a complete overhaul into the research system as a whole:

- for a ship to be researched it must be recycled at the research station in order to add it to the list of research the caveat is that recycling at the research station yeilds no ship building materials this will be a good way to simulate taking the ship apart the bigger the ship the longer the recycle process takes and if your allowed to have multiple research stations in a single sector that makes if a much more viable option in research speed and development
- cap ships should be captured and scrapped in order to research (with exception of first TL as this should be automatically be allowed to be researched to prevent an instant game over on death of your TL)
- higher value ships such as CaimanSFXL should be a rare occurrence in the game world and again only researchable after recycling (so in other words in order to get one you must either get a bailed ship or buy it from a faction) the standard freighters/fighters should be far more common also this will add more depth to the game

[alexalsp]

How do you imagine it?
How to capture? With a beam? With a landing party that was turned off long ago? By hand to take it?

This is not X4.

Why complicate the game? Every ship should be scanned by a research station in the sector, or should I send a wave through the sector and scan all the ships?

There's a scanner, that's enough.

And to engage in recycling is additional action, which is enough as it is.

[Retrox]

I've just seen that you're back to modding Mayhem Joubarbe. Seems like every year close to april, a certain big panda will appear and release some new patches

[MiguelA1]

Hey Joubarbe, love your work. This mod is really a joy to play.

Just wanted to give you a quick heads up about a typo: Encyclopedia -> Mayhem Help -> Mechanics -> L) Terraforming

The last sentence in the description says "However, terraforming a planet is a dangerous planet that will awaken ancient threats...".

I think it should say "is dangerous task" or similar, right?

Thank you for sharing your work.

[Betelgeuse97]

Why complicate the game? Every ship should be scanned by a research station in the sector, or should I send a wave through the sector and scan all the ships?

There's a scanner, that's enough.

And to engage in recycling is additional action, which is enough as it is.

Scrapping a ship to unlock the ability to research its blueprint was a feature back in Mayhem 2. Back then, the scanner did not grant research points but instead unlocked research.

Few more suggestion regarding the research:

-NO Research Station limited to be only one in each sector. The player should be able to fill up a sector with only research stations to max the research bonus.
-When the game started the player should be only able to research the ships of the game start Faction. All the other faction's ship can not be researched till the player captured one and have it recycled (physically researched in other words). That would be more fun and challenging. In current games player just pick the best ship among all the factions and some of the ships will never ever be researched or built.

What happens if you find a high research bonus sector (say 100% in a normal game) that has 10 station slots and also contains a Terran memory? Does this mean that I can drop 10 research stations in that same sector so that I get 100 points (10 pts per station) of Terran research per research cycle?

Agreed that the research should be overhauled so that the player chooses different ships in each playthrough. It shouldn't be a game where the player picks exactly the same ships in every playthrough.

@Joubarbe, why lock researching an enemy faction's ships when that faction is in permanent war?

[Joubarbe]

@Joubarbe, why lock researching an enemy faction's ships when that faction is in permanent war?

That's basically my answer to this conversation. It allows you to choose your own restrictions, in a roleplay / sandbox way.
Keep in mind that many ships cannot be found in the galaxy, and they're only accessible through research.

[Hairless-Ape]

Actually I like 3.17 but my only concern is the balance. In previous version M2 ship is all I have to build and it kills any other ship easily. I really like to see how the weapon/equipment affects the ship's capability like in EVE. Big ships with big/slow guns should not be able to easily hit small and fast ship. Few small ships may not harm the big ships in any ways but with sworms of small ships there is a still chance that the big fish can be eaten by small fish. But in current game small ship can't even get closer to the big ship.

I've played eve since 2003 and strongly believe X3 has done this aspect far better. Large ships, in reality, are more than capable of mounting FLAK artillery, capable of killing small fast moving ships. In eve, this has been nerfed like so many other things in eve. In eve, if it's working well, they nerf it Anyway, the point is that it is far more realistic that large ships fielding FLAK type weapons should absolutely be able to burn through many small fighters. Eve screwed this up to force players to work in multi-role fleets, but it's simply their mindset of forcing people into groups and favoring the large groups over individuals. I do agree large guns should have a hard time tracking small targets. X3 models that somewhat already because large guns fire at a very slow speed, and often Do miss agile targets.

[Hector0x]

all these concepts sound great until you condsider OOS combat. It has such a basic calculation that a big slow gun will always hit even the smallest targets and even if only 1/2 the turrets would actually be able to fire. This overpowers capships and nerfs fighters. The reverse is usually true when the player is present in the same sector. If you start introducing an extreme balancing which allows capships to miss a lot and fighters to dodge, you will always get this very annoying discrepancy of in sector vs. OOS. Then the player will always just cheese the mechanics and switch sector to maximize his effectiveness.

Egosoft really missed the opportunity to add 2 simple OOS stats. 'Evasion' for ships and 'Accuracy' for guns. Just basic % chances which allow a damage tick to miss depending from which gun it came from and the target ship to dodge based on its evasion stat. They didn't do it, so we are stuck with just basic raw damage vs. total hull/shield.

[Joubarbe]

3.18 released!

[TestUnknown]

Found a bug in Mayhem Galaxy Generator.exe (3/26/2021 6:09am): when the galaxy size is 18x18, the pronunciation of the sector name doesn't match the actual sector name. This is repeatable and seems to happen only if the galaxy size is 18x18. I tried smaller galaxies such as 16x16 and they work just fine. Here is an example galaxy file. https://drive.google.com/file/d/1icw6i- ... sp=sharing . Start any new game and pick Argon which will start at Akeela's Beacon. The north gate should be Ronkarr's Trial but targeting it will say "Tears of greed".

[alexalsp]

3.14d I think this problem goes to 3.18 as well

There is such an error. Checked on the English and Russian game.

With the maximum map, the discrepancy between the text and the voice acting.

I generated another galaxy with different parameters, but also large, the text and voice acting are correct.

Somewhere in the generation of such a configuration of the galaxy, an error.