[MOD] [TC/AP] X3 Rebalance Mod (XRM) - Total conversion - v1.30d (02.12.13)

[joelR]

Exit and re enter the ship.

I jumped outside in a space suite and then jumped back in again. No change. The speed/distance font is still huge and misplaced.

Does the cockpit mod come after both XRM cats?

[Scoob]

Hi Paul,

Here's one for you...

I started using M8's for the first time (yeah, I know lol) and found one to be quite useful early game. I had it loaded with Tommahawks and had it protect me and it took out a Xenon C. Nice.

Going up against larger foes a single M8 was largely ineffective, so I built up my fleet and brought FOUR to the fight. However this proved no better than a single M8 as instead of all four launching their missiles at once - and so overwhelming the enemy - they each fired in turn. I.e first M8 fired, pause, fired until empty, then the next once started. 8x Missile volleys are being done, but missiles are quite readily shot down by larger ships, even with the missiles having hull in AP.

Is this intended behaviour as the ships actions seem very deliberate and aware of other M8's in the group. Note: it does this if the ships are in a wing or as individuals.

Additionally an M8 seems unable to use Missile Defence Mosquito. It's running and the ship has mosquitos but they never launch - I guess it's because the Tommahawks are equipped. However I've notcied that NPC M8's all have both Tommahawks and Mosquitos on-board so I assume it's intended to work.

What are others experiences with M8's in AP:XRM? I ask because I've not really used M8's in vanilla TC or AP, let alone XRM.

Cheers,

Scoob.

[paulwheeler]

I have just installed XRM and started the "Aldran Adventurer", getting a nice Springblossom as starting ship.

I installed the cockpit mod as well to get a cooler looking cockpit. It looks really great except for one real annoyance.
The speed and distance values are shown in a HUGE font, at about 1/4 of the screen from the bottom. It looks really ugly and does not fit the cockpit layout at all. I do get the same data in the top-right corner as well, but here it is part of the cockpit and looks like it belongs.

I tried with several of the cockpit mods linked from the main page, but all of them had the same error. Only when I deleted the cockpit mod I got the speed/distance gauges to look good again.

Anyone else seen this? Any way to fix it?

You just need to change sectors.

[feygan]

Hi Paul,

Here's one for you...

I started using M8's for the first time (yeah, I know lol) and found one to be quite useful early game. I had it loaded with Tommahawks and had it protect me and it took out a Xenon C. Nice.

Going up against larger foes a single M8 was largely ineffective, so I built up my fleet and brought FOUR to the fight. However this proved no better than a single M8 as instead of all four launching their missiles at once - and so overwhelming the enemy - they each fired in turn. I.e first M8 fired, pause, fired until empty, then the next once started. 8x Missile volleys are being done, but missiles are quite readily shot down by larger ships, even with the missiles having hull in AP.

Is this intended behaviour as the ships actions seem very deliberate and aware of other M8's in the group. Note: it does this if the ships are in a wing or as individuals.

Additionally an M8 seems unable to use Missile Defence Mosquito. It's running and the ship has mosquitos but they never launch - I guess it's because the Tommahawks are equipped. However I've notcied that NPC M8's all have both Tommahawks and Mosquitos on-board so I assume it's intended to work.

What are others experiences with M8's in AP:XRM? I ask because I've not really used M8's in vanilla TC or AP, let alone XRM.

Cheers,

Scoob.

I've noticed this same effect with M8's. After messing about with them for an hour or more I managed to use them in three ways with different results.

1. When launched from a CODEA carrier they simply do nothing at all until I alter the missile turret setting to "attack all enemies", however the group launched then still only launch in turns (bomber 1 fires away while the others do nothing until B1 is empty then B1 begins etc). I realise this may not be an XRM issue but figured I would throw it out there.

2. Setting up 4 M8's to a wing results in nothing at all being fired unless again I set the missile turret to "attack all enemies", Once again they seem to take turns in emptying their payloads. Also this method prevents mass barrage attacks as the wing command menu doesn't seem to have the barrage option. Also the "attack all enemies" turret means in a large battle the payloads don't always get concerntrated where I want them.

3. Sending a single M8 to either follow me or attack a target means it will fire all tubes until empty the way it should do, and allows me to use the missile barrage command on a target enemy. Again though I require "attack all enemies" to be the turret command if the M8 is to do it's own missile firing.

This now results in my M8 ships just sitting in the hanger deck coming out one at a time to fire off all they can with barrage command at the farthest distance possible before docking again. Otherwise the whole operation takes so much menu clicking that it becomes a libaility in a large battle, that I've resorted back to M7M and left the M8 back in the shipyard.

[paulwheeler]

Hi Paul,

Here's one for you...

I started using M8's for the first time (yeah, I know lol) and found one to be quite useful early game. I had it loaded with Tommahawks and had it protect me and it took out a Xenon C. Nice.

Going up against larger foes a single M8 was largely ineffective, so I built up my fleet and brought FOUR to the fight. However this proved no better than a single M8 as instead of all four launching their missiles at once - and so overwhelming the enemy - they each fired in turn. I.e first M8 fired, pause, fired until empty, then the next once started. 8x Missile volleys are being done, but missiles are quite readily shot down by larger ships, even with the missiles having hull in AP.

Is this intended behaviour as the ships actions seem very deliberate and aware of other M8's in the group. Note: it does this if the ships are in a wing or as individuals.

Additionally an M8 seems unable to use Missile Defence Mosquito. It's running and the ship has mosquitos but they never launch - I guess it's because the Tommahawks are equipped. However I've notcied that NPC M8's all have both Tommahawks and Mosquitos on-board so I assume it's intended to work.

What are others experiences with M8's in AP:XRM? I ask because I've not really used M8's in vanilla TC or AP, let alone XRM.

Cheers,

Scoob.

This is a question for Gazz really. He wrote the AP missile boat scripts. The xrm hasn't altered them at all.

Personally I've seen all M8s in a wing fire simultaneously for the ai, although I've not tested it with player owned ships. Do all your bombers have both fight command softwares installed and what turret orders are you using?

Missile defence mosquitos is built in to AP as standard. I'd imagine installing the stand alone script will break things.

[paulwheeler]

I am very tempted by this mod, it looks very impressive.
However whilst I have looked, ( not all pages! ) I find little mention of the Khaak. Is there an option to buy khaak ships, or better yet a Khaak start?

I think that could be a clincher!

( Sorry for asking such a basic question, its probably there somewhere, but I missed it. over 700 pages!)

There is no khaak start and you can't buy the ships. But the khaak do feature very prominently with lots of new ships.

[paulwheeler]

Thx... Next question:

Shipyards, they were supposed to build ships faster and whith less mats, but where are they sold?

You can get them from USC or Teladi shipyards.

[MrIgnem]

Does the cockpit mod come after both XRM cats?

Yes, I even have it last in the order.

I did some trading and managed to get enough money to buy me a Discoverer. It did not have this ugly text.

I also tried using the numpad keys to look around in the cockpit and the huge text was fixed to the cockpit. It seems to me that the text is an integral part of the Springblossom cockpit.

In short, false alarm

Thanks for trying to help me. Much appreciated

[Scoob]

Hi,

THe M8 behaviour is odd. I'd been using them with their missile turret set to "Attack Capitals" to ensure they hit the dangerous enemies first. They only open fire when I'm within 16.5km of the target consistantly - might be a scanner range thing, I can see further but they cannot possibly.

If I ask them to attack the target (turret commands unchanged) they tend to fly towards the enemy, not fire, and die.

Setting their missile turret to "Attack enemies" - in this case a group of laser towers - see's two launching at the time time, though only a single missile, which makes sense. Very effective vs. laser towers. As an aside laser towers in small groups own big ships now!

However, I later asked them to attack a station, they closed in and again at least two of them were launching at the same time - this time a full 8 missile barrage.

I wish they were bright enough to stay away from their targets also. I mean they should sit well out of range of capital ships or stations (and their defenders) and spam missiles. But, like every other ship in the game, they try to get close. As we see this same characteristic basically everywhere I assume it's an engine limitation.

I think I'll keep M8's for taking out stations and laser towers as they seem good at that. They also manage well against lighter M7's and of course M6's but one stray missile aimed at them and they're toast.

Still having fun, just trying to play around with things I've not before.

Up next: M7M's

Cheers,

Scoob.

[paulwheeler]

Don't give them a main order. Send them to an out of the way position, set the main ship command to none or standby, and set the turrets to attack all or attack target. They should then sit still and happily fire their missiles barrages at enemies.

[Scoob]

Yeah, I had some success with that. I'd been ording them to "Follow me" and letting their turrets do the work. However, with stations, you have to order them to attack or they ignore them.

When you do order them to attack a station they fly towards it. This is fine at first, the initial volleys land, however once they are close to the station and trying to avoid they tend to launch missiles which then circle the station and self-destruct at best, or blow themselves up at worst. Seem a little hit and miss.

I'm going to try fitting the M8's with better scanners to see if their behaviour improves.

Cheers,

Scoob.

[paulwheeler]

I'd have thought the "attack target" turret command would work on stations without actually setting the main ship order...

[A5PECT]

If an AI ship is sitting there with the "None" or "Standby" command then the ship won't have a target, so any turrets running the "Attack Target" command won't fire. They won't start firing until you issue them an attack command (which makes them acquire a target) or they get hit (which automatically makes makes the attacking enemy their target.)

[BGrey]

I have been wondering a bit about the M/AML myself. In both its old form and the current form it rarely seems to hit fighters and while it can hit corvettes, so can the PSP. I guess I just don't see much of a role for its current form (or even its previous iteration).

On another note I recently started using an M7M and am kind of confused about the missile barrage command. I remember someone saying the refire rate had been reduced so you cant empty your cargo and jump out but reissuing the command seems to launch the next salvo immediately.

[nap_rz]

I have been wondering a bit about the M/AML myself. In both its old form and the current form it rarely seems to hit fighters and while it can hit corvettes, so can the PSP. I guess I just don't see much of a role for its current form (or even its previous iteration).

you hit it! the gun is pointless, but I still want it , matter / anti matter launcher sounds cooler than fusion pulse disruptor or starburst shockwave cannon or even fusion beam cannon...

[paulwheeler]

And I have been trying to make it useful as a unique weapon.

But lets be honest here... you want me to make it the same as it was in CMOD4 i.e. in the same role as the Fusion Pulse Disruptor and make it better than all other medium weapons, despite the fact that it no longer needs ammo to fire.

Well I'm not going to do that.

Now it is a very good sniper weapon. It has a very long range and fast bullet speed similar to the Gauss cannon and with its slower fire rate, each bullet now packs a very large punch, although its damage over time is not as good as the FPD.

It needs to remain different to the FPD and I will not make it more powerful. It needs to be a specialist weapon.

Comparing it to the PSP is a moot point as it can be mounted on ships that cannot mount the PSP.

I say again - the M/AML is a frigate weapon not a heavy weapon - it is not meant to compete with the PSP or FBC.

Things I will consider:

making the bullet speed faster. Its still quite a way off of Gauss speeds.

A bit more range. Its the longest range medium weapon now, but could still maybe get a bit longer.

I will look at damage to an extent, but I will not make it the Uber weapon you want it to be just because it has a "cool" name - thats not what the XRM is about!

[Mad_CatMk2]

Hi,

THe M8 behaviour is odd. I'd been using them with their missile turret set to "Attack Capitals" to ensure they hit the dangerous enemies first. They only open fire when I'm within 16.5km of the target consistantly - might be a scanner range thing, I can see further but they cannot possibly.

If I ask them to attack the target (turret commands unchanged) they tend to fly towards the enemy, not fire, and die.

Setting their missile turret to "Attack enemies" - in this case a group of laser towers - see's two launching at the time time, though only a single missile, which makes sense. Very effective vs. laser towers. As an aside laser towers in small groups own big ships now!

However, I later asked them to attack a station, they closed in and again at least two of them were launching at the same time - this time a full 8 missile barrage.

I wish they were bright enough to stay away from their targets also. I mean they should sit well out of range of capital ships or stations (and their defenders) and spam missiles. But, like every other ship in the game, they try to get close. As we see this same characteristic basically everywhere I assume it's an engine limitation.

I think I'll keep M8's for taking out stations and laser towers as they seem good at that. They also manage well against lighter M7's and of course M6's but one stray missile aimed at them and they're toast.

Still having fun, just trying to play around with things I've not before.

Up next: M7M's

Cheers,

Scoob.

If only we can adapt the CODEA bomber attack routines into XRM (i.e. stay at a certain range/formation and hammer away).

@Paul: is this even possible to be done by you? Or would it take too much effort to modify the attack scripts?

EDIT: Side note, anyone have a copy of the latest Bounce wall file avialable for download?

[paulwheeler]

I'm really not a scripting expert. Its really not something I want to get into in a big way and rewriting the vanilla attack scripts is a massive undertaking.

[Mad_CatMk2]

Right, I figured so, no worries.

[Sorkvild]

I'm coming back with my unanswered question - is there a data sheet for missiles available? Range, types, dmg, tracking info etc..