Russia-Ukraine War

[Tamina]

germany delivers their old "strela" missiles
in germany these are not allowed to be used anymore because of material deficiencies ^^

in other words, germany delivers its trash missiles to the ukranians (and possibly buys new ones for themselves)

in my view, thats a clear "f*ck'em, who cares" ^^

Just from the news - without any clear idea about the whole topic - my though was: Why even bother. At the end some soldiers will risk their lifes trying to engage an enemy with a non-working weapon or worse...

[mr.WHO]

Good news, the Zaphorozian Nuclear Power Plant has been put to sucessful shut down, so there is no risk of meltdown now.

Still there are more Power plants on the path of r*tarded red bear.

The plan was captured last week by Russia without a single opposition. Why they would need to bomb it now?
Think.

Even USA said today the whole incident might be a false flag by Ukraine.

And no reactor was damaged. Just some offices and the fire was put our by the Russians.

So you want to say that super stealth Russian commandos quietly capture A NUCLEAR POWER PLANT deep behind enemy lines and hold for a week without nobody noticing?

Yeah, seems very plausible.

[Alan Phipps]

Regarding Strela missiles provided by Germany: 'old' missile systems does not mean inoperative. Until recently the UK still used operationally at least one missile system from the 1960s. Also these MANPADS missiles (NATO designation Gaskin or Grail) are of Russian origin and therefore likely to be known to and experienced by the Ukrainian forces at some past stage. (Not that I am sure of that.)

[burger1]

Oracle, Microsoft and Intel follow Apple in sanctions and stop doing business in Russia.

Facebook is shutdown. Etc.... BBC and some other stuff is blocked. Russias basically shutting down, controlling media and communications.

Russia will likely impose martial law on March 4

Russia passes new laws and punishments for speaking out against Russia and its activities.

Sanctions taking effect

https://youtu.be/bu6xUG9zoRg?t=257

[Warenwolf]

So you want to say that super stealth Russian commandos quietly capture A NUCLEAR POWER PLANT deep behind enemy lines and hold for a week without nobody noticing?

Yeah, seems very plausible.

Actually entire Ukraine has been captured by stealthy Putin forces but nobody has noticed.

This forum software needs block function...

[greypanther]

You mistaken the presidents - Poroshenko, who fight now in streets of Kiyv is from pro-west faction.

Yes, thank you for correcting me, sorry about that. It is still sort of impressive in a way though, an ex leader fighting on the street to defend his people. I cannot imagine David Cameron et al, doing similar if the UK got invaded. Not that, that is very likely, unless the French have some hidden agenda...

Got to say, there are an awful lot of NATO cargo planes landing near the border, according to Fligtradar, including some from Greece. ( Thought they were broke. )

I almost feel sorry for Vlad, he seems to be having a mental health crisis, or will soon. Shame non of his friends seem willing to get him the professional help he clearly needs.

[mr.WHO]

A happy story to cheer up the mood:


Near my hometown in Poland, there was a train line that was inactive for over 20 years, that was leading to Ukraine border crossing.

Polish railways reactivated, fixed and tested the entire line back into operational shape in just 4 days.

Now the train station, where I had a bus stop on my way to school, is turned into refugee center for trains going in and out of Ukraine.

Whole Poland is already going in war-time mode.

[Tamina]

Regarding Strela missiles provided by Germany: 'old' missile systems does not mean inoperative. Until recently the UK still used operationally at least one missile system from the 1960s. Also these MANPADS missiles (NATO designation Gaskin or Grail) are of Russian origin and therefore likely to be known to and experienced by the Ukrainian forces at some past stage. (Not that I am sure of that.)

The use of those weapons was prohibited by the Bundeswehr (military) since 2012. Since then they were stored away to be forgotten in wooden boxes, which are so moldy now that they had to retreive the equipment with protective gear, and about 700 of those 2000 were now delcared to have "major flaws" and are not shipped. Whatever that means? They could not just be not operative but also very dangerous.. I really hope it is better than nothing.

A happy story to cheer up the mood:
[...]
Whole Poland is already going in war-time mode.

I am so cheered up right now, you can't believe how cheered up I am right now

No seriously, really great of you guys being so helpful. I am cheering for you. And hope you find a long term solution for all those people. Houses take time to be built and this conflict could go on for a long time.

[mr.WHO]

I am so cheered up right now, you can't believe how cheered up I am right now

No seriously, really great of you guys being so helpful. I am cheering for you. And hope you find a long term solution for all those people. Houses take time to be built and this conflict could go on for a long time.

Well, maybe cheerful was not a right word, more like hopeful.
I seriously would not expect what we could do in just a week (I'd rather expect it would take us at least a month to even sort out what is going on).
Both EU and NATO are also more reactive than expected.

Now that the lifeline is established, we need like 100'000 to 200'000 volunteers to push back this madness.
This is probably overestimated for PR purpose, but Ukraine said that already 16'000 volunteers signed in in embassies all around the world.
If Ukraine will hold for one more week, it will hold for good.


BTW on today emergency UN Security Council meeting, aparently EVERYONE, including China were furious about that battle at Nuclear Power Plant.
I also mentioned there are other NPP in Ukraine under danger, 5 to be precise, 2 are now in direct danger (one in North-West near Belarus, one in South-West, near Odessa).

[burger1]

Maybe China or a neutral force should be protecting the power plants and placing them off limits to attack.

People might be defecting from militaries to join the volunteer force. Thought the number was higher than 16000.

[mr.WHO]

Wasn't it 16,000 volunteers moved into combat with 80,000+ volunteers.

16'000 is foreign volunteers signed to arrive.
80'000 is Ukraine reservist mobilized.

[mr.WHO]

And hope you find a long term solution for all those people. Houses take time to be built and this conflict could go on for a long time.

I think one reason, why it work so good is that we already have about 1 mil Ukrainians from 2014 conflict.
They settled in Poland and have work and housing.
Many refugees from now have some relatives already here to keep them going for some time.
Most of big cities and goverment offices in Poland are already experienced and adapted to provide for Ukrainians (e.g. most of IT and information system has Ukrainian language option).

Just today Polish goverment declared that they don't want to make/build refugee camps, but rather disperse them in avaliable housing space and convert unused buildings (e.g. with COVID home-office, you can easily get rid a lot of office building and convert them to makeshift housing).

It will be cramped, it will be a challenge, but unless it's like additional 2+ milions, it's doable.

The good thing is that both Poles and Ukrainians can speak to eachother in their own language and still somewhat understand.
I can't read the cyrillic for sh*t, but at least vocally there are many language similarities - once Ukrainian learn latin alphabet or Pole learn cyrillic then it's quite easy from there.

[mr.WHO]

Additional idea that will be crucial for future, is that all the money and property confiscated from Russian oligarchs should be donated for Ukraine's reconstruction and refuges coverage.

Having 50+ spare bilion $ would really help to fix the situation in a few years.

[burger1]

BBC is broadcasting over shortwave radio to Russia now. With news and updates. Maybe it wasn't before?

Russia might be having a hard time controlling all forms of information.

[Vertigo 7]

Additional idea that will be crucial for future, is that all the money and property confiscated from Russian oligarchs should be donated for Ukraine's reconstruction and refuges coverage.

Having 50+ spare bilion $ would really help to fix the situation in a few years.

Unfortunately, most of it is just going to be frozen to be released at some later date. Only money received from the property seizures will become property of the governments from which they have jurisdictional control.

Personally, I think every penny of it should go to Ukraine and its refugees.

[burger1]

Could use the money to hire mercenaries or buy equipment for Ukraine. Croatia might have sent in 200 mercenaries.

They have 600 billion of Russias money? + other stuff. I can't see at any point giving it back to them in the near future.

[Tamina]

The good thing is that both Poles and Ukrainians can speak to eachother in their own language and still somewhat understand.
I can't read the cyrillic for sh*t, but at least vocally there are many language similarities - once Ukrainian learn latin alphabet or Pole learn cyrillic then it's quite easy from there.

That certainly helps a lot My grandma was taking an Ukrainian in for some time, after the events of 2014, until he left by himself and returned home. He was very nice in general, and spoke a tiny bit German. I liked the.. "Eastern blockish warmth".. I don't know how to explain it. However there certainly also was a major lack of respect towards women. I don't know if she thinks about taking another refugee in but I hope this was not a "cultural" thing. On the other hand better than not being able to communicate at all.

[Vertigo 7]

So that big convoy has been effectively stopped. Ukrainian forces have created several roadblocks by destroying the head of the convoy in a bottle neck and taking out a critical bridge. Additionally, some analysists believe (perhaps optimistically) that Russia no longer has the resources to continue the conflict beyond Sunday, thanks to the sanctions. Severe lack of food and fuel for the Russian troops is putting them at a major disadvantage.

[mr.WHO]

Unfortunately, most of it is just going to be frozen to be released at some later date. Only money received from the property seizures will become property of the governments from which they have jurisdictional control.

Personally, I think every penny of it should go to Ukraine and its refugees.

Well, I wouldn't be suprised, if greed would prevail, but there might be some suprise here and there.

In Warsaw, city officials decided to takeover an empty building owned by Russian Federation and will make it to housing for refugees.
While the building is not in stellar condition, it probably can be restored back to shape in two or three months:
https://bi.im-g.pl/im/04/97/14/z2159078 ... 5-roku.jpg


Now imagine doing an auction for these ****** yahts and mansions all over the world.

Even, if only a fracture will be seized, it will make a difference.

[Vertigo 7]

Why does that remind me of the Triskellion? lol...

Well there's a chance the governments will auction off the property and turn over the funds. There's a crazy amount of money going into Ukraine so I guess it really doesn't matter where it comes from but I would personally enjoy the irony of selling Russian property to fund Ukraine's liberation.