Trump Presidency

[fiksal]

It would be wise for liberal progressives to ask themselves what happened and return to a saner approach. One that is more in step with the times. The alternative is for them to continue embracing crazy extremism and see their dreams evaporate even further.

I am not sure US needs two white nationalists parties, or another neo fascist candidate. One party is enough.

If Democrats lost for not being nationalist and anti democracy enough, then it's a good loss.

[clakclak]

The ballot was Trump-Vance, not Trump-Musk.

True, but Trump has the right to bring in any advisors that he chooses. Let's see what kind of ideas Musk comes up with and then whether or not Trump agrees. There is no doubt that the United States is heading off a fiscal cliff. Probably there is a lot of waste in government spending. Hopefully Musk will have some sensible suggestions.

Advisor, strictly on burecracy cuts is fine.
A Rasputin like shadow President that aparently knows-all and have hand in everything is not fine.

WTF Musk is doing in diplomacy? That is not his area of expertise and never was.
There was already multiple leaders that confirmed Musk was in the room or on the line when they talked with Trump.

Elon Musk bought his place fair and square. There was no secrecy, no hiding or double play. Before the election both he and Trump made it clear that Musk would be strongly involves in the next government. And Trump created a position for him to influence the government in any way he sees fit. The power to cut whatever he likes is mind boggling. Just think about the riots France has whenever social security is being discussed, yet here Musk can ax entire departments.

I personally assume this is going to set an interesting precedent, although I’d reckon that in the future it will not be individuals who buy government jobs, but non natural persons (aka cooperations). So instead of Musk doing the job he is doing right now it will be a board of Coca-Cola, Tesla and so deciding how government money is going to be spent.

[Warenwolf]

Elon Musk bought his place fair and square. There was no secrecy, no hiding or double play. Before the election both he and Trump made it clear that Musk would be strongly involves in the next government.

This part I agree with. Is Musk a oligarch in the way, a russian oligarch is? Yes. But american voters (a majority) want this and support this and have expressed it through a democratic process. This was kinda announced.
Also not unusual for USA - last time Trump ruled the country, plenty of people around him had influence way beyond their portfolios (or capabilities I would argue) - Jared Kushner was involved in both diplomacy of US, its health response to Covid and passing of a criminal justice reform bill

[Vertigo 7]

Elon Musk bought his place fair and square. There was no secrecy, no hiding or double play. Before the election both he and Trump made it clear that Musk would be strongly involves in the next government.

This part I agree with. Is Musk a oligarch in the way, a russian oligarch is? Yes. But american voters (a majority) want this and support this and have expressed it through a democratic process. This was kinda announced.
Also not unusual for USA - last time Trump ruled the country, plenty of people around him had influence way beyond their portfolios (or capabilities I would argue) - Jared Kushner was involved in both diplomacy of US, its health response to Covid and passing of a criminal justice reform bill

Just to clarify. Are you agreeing that's what happened or agreeing that it's okay that it happened?

[mr.WHO]

Hmm, Russian Oligarch? Given that the dude has Putin on speed dial this might be more literal than anticipated.

My bets are that Musk will be first to stab Trump in the back, end up with the most court cases/warrants and possibly even run away to Russia or China after his dismissal.

I'm saying this purely based on Musk character and way of doing business - economy and administration is not Starship - you can't just crash it multiple times till you figure out whats wrong.

[Warenwolf]

Just to clarify. Are you agreeing that's what happened or agreeing that it's okay that it happened?

I agree that it has happened and you have to clarify what you mean by OK that it has happened?
- As in OK = "legal and according to the traditions of US politics recently or long term established"? Yeah, I would argue it is. Hence me pointing to last time Trump ruled states of america.

- As in OK, "great that it has happened"?
No eastern european (where I hail from) with IQ above room temperature will think that oligarchs prancing around corridors of power is a great idea. IF Trump and Musk remain BFF, I can fully expect that Musk along with US-Indian grifter (can't remember his name) will cut costs in regulatory bodies of government, NASA programs will get rolled back (SpaceX will take over...the burden... with government grants of course), laws will be FURTHER deregulated, etc, etc...
Will this be good for the "average joe"? - nope, but he did vote for it and may he be grateful for whatever comes his way next four years.

PS: Another free future prediction from me: In 20 years time, if everything goes well for USA, everyone will deny they ever voted for Trump.

[Vertigo 7]

Just to clarify. Are you agreeing that's what happened or agreeing that it's okay that it happened?

I agree that it has happened and you have to clarify what you mean by OK that it has happened?
- As in OK = "legal and according to the traditions of US politics recently or long term established"? Yeah, I would argue it is. Hence me pointing to last time Trump ruled states of america.

- As in OK, "great that it has happened"?
No eastern european (where I hail from) with IQ above room temperature will think that oligarchs prancing around corridors of power is a great idea. IF Trump and Musk remain BFF, I can fully expect that Musk along with US-Indian grifter (can't remember his name) will cut costs in regulatory bodies of government, NASA programs will get rolled back (SpaceX will take over...the burden... with government grants of course), laws will be FURTHER deregulated, etc, etc...
Will this be good for the "average joe"? - nope, but he did vote for it and may he be grateful for whatever comes his way next four years.

PS: Another free future prediction from me: In 20 years time, if everything goes well for USA, everyone will deny they ever voted for Trump.

Well you answered my question. I didn't think you were okay with oligarchs pulling the strings. I would even argue that no one, left or right, wants a shadow government. Hell, his first term that was one of the things he campaigned against, claiming some super secret cabal was running things with no evidence, as per usual. But he made his imbecilic followers believe it was real and something for them to be afraid of. Now here he is creating his own shadow government. I'm sure the irony is completely lost on his moronic cultists.

[Observe]

If Democrats lost for not being nationalist and anti democracy enough, then it's a good loss.

Democrats lost because they have wholesale embraced far-left ideology and have completely lost sight of their base (where the votes are). Saying "it's a good loss", doesn't help your cause.

Bill Maher put it well: "It's important for America to have a center-left party and for that party to be competitive. And a good first step toward that goal would be to make the voters not want to punch you in the face."

[Vertigo 7]

If Democrats lost for not being nationalist and anti democracy enough, then it's a good loss.

Democrats lost because they have wholesale embraced far-left ideology and have completely lost sight of their base (where the votes are). Saying "it's a good loss", doesn't help your cause.

Bill Maher put it well: "It's important for America to have a center-left party and for that party to be competitive. And a good first step toward that goal would be to make the voters not want to punch you in the face."

viewtopic.php?p=5254259#p5254259

Still waiting for you to prove what you're claiming, Observe. I mean, I'm not really expecting you to be able to answer the question. Every time you get challenged to back up your claims you fail to do so. I see this as no different, especially considering what you're claiming is 100% false.

[clakclak]

If Democrats lost for not being nationalist and anti democracy enough, then it's a good loss.

Democrats lost because they have wholesale embraced far-left ideology and have completely lost sight of their base (where the votes are). […]

Ah yes, I too remember the speech in which Harris said that for a functioning state the workers should seize the means of productions and put dunce caps on the landlords. Great times! Was that before or after she declared the international to be the new government anthem?

[Observe]

Still waiting for you to prove what you're claiming, Observe. I mean, I'm not really expecting you to be able to answer the question. Every time you get challenged to back up your claims you fail to do so. I see this as no different, especially considering what you're claiming is 100% false.

I am not here to prove anything and the only thing I am claiming, is my opinion. The results speak for themselves. Your challenge is in interpreting (or accepting) the data. For that, you must do your own research.

[Vertigo 7]

Still waiting for you to prove what you're claiming, Observe. I mean, I'm not really expecting you to be able to answer the question. Every time you get challenged to back up your claims you fail to do so. I see this as no different, especially considering what you're claiming is 100% false.

I am not here to prove anything and the only thing I am claiming, is my opinion. The results speak for themselves. Your challenge is in interpreting the data. For that, you must do your own research.

If you're not going to back up your claims, why should anyone pay any attention to you? That whole critical thinking thing your side lacks is on full display here.

I followed both campaigns, I know what was proposed by both sides. Its clear you didn't. I'm betting you only got your information from faux news. They sure as hell spent a lot of time making false claims about the democrat's policies. Of course, anyone who went to the Harris website would have seen the faux news claims are BS, if they didn't want to listen to her speeches firsthand. But thats not how your side operates. Faux news is your source of truth.

Here's some news for ya. Your opinions are NOT fact. Of course, that didn't come from faux news so I doubt it'll sink in.

[Alerion_V.X3]

From the perspective of someone outside of the moderate political spectrum on the far right conservative side, anything that doesn't dance to the tune of “MAGA” Trump is probably far left.

This has been so propagated by Goebbels-Musk and the Orange Hitler, and has been compliantly adopted by the so-called “moderate” right as well, it seems. So it must be true. The all opportunistic Republicans are now truly the “Trump Party”, the rest are criminals (like Trump himself), rapists, racists, "christian" fundamentalists and worse varieties of saliva-licking freeloaders.

[fiksal]

If Democrats lost for not being nationalist and anti democracy enough, then it's a good loss.

Democrats lost because they have wholesale embraced far-left ideology and have completely lost sight of their base (where the votes are). Saying "it's a good loss", doesn't help your cause.

Bill Maher put it well: "It's important for America to have a center-left party and for that party to be competitive. And a good first step toward that goal would be to make the voters not want to punch you in the face."

for American MAGA, yes, Democrats are far left. For outside of US, Democrats are conservatives with a light liberal flavor.

My cause is democracy, liberty and social security. You are right that those are often not American values.

Sometimes Democrats drop one of these when appealing to MAGA base

This time they didn't, thus why there's no shame in this loss.

[clakclak]

Well net neutrality was nice while it lasted. I guess we can also say goodbye to that with this latest appointment.

Edit: Also not like it matters anymore or as if anyone really cares, but Carr also was a co-author if Project 2025 which Trump allegedly did not know.

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/trump- ... 024-11-18/

[clakclak]

[,,,]
What's really gonna be hilarious, if this is truly Darth Hamburders choice, I can't waaaaiiiit to watch his senate confirmation hearing. They're gonna rip that brain worm food guy to peices.

I think it is very likely that the Trump administration will bypass the senate confirmation hearings via recess appointments, at least for the most controversial people like RFK and Gaetz. That way they will not have to answer any questions. Any challanges against going this route will be shut down by the supreme court.

I'm not so sure the senate is going to play ball. The new senate majority leader is not a MAGA loyalist. I guess we'll see if he has a spine or not. I know the odds are against it with him being a republican and all.

It seems as if you were right. There will apparently not be any recess appointments.

Source: https://www.rawstory.com/trump-mcconnel ... 24_12.53pm

[Vertigo 7]

That would indeed be some fantastic news. Appearances are there's quite a bit of buyer's remorse out there over voting for the orange diaper man. Someone has to reign the nazi bastard in.

[matthewfarmery]

The problem is, Moscow Mitch has ZERO balls. He and his cronies could have removed Trump from office twice, but failed to do so. The problem is, Moscow Mitch has little or no power to change anything now. No one says no to that orange menace. And by doing that now, Moscow Mitch will very likely be ousted from his position. Once he is gone, he will be replaced by a Trump supporter who will give Trump whatever he desires. Which means a Senate that will give Trump absolute power.

Even if some of the positions get challenged now, how long for? not long, then we see all those posted being taken up by whoever Trump wants. Then America will never be the same again. Either this gets challenged now, blocked, or Trump will get his way. But its too little, too later in my book. And America and the rest of the world will see in horror what Trump will do.

[Vertigo 7]

moscow mitch did not enter into the running for senate majority lead. its someone else in an upset to the MAGA freaks, esp Rick Scott, that won the position. Don't know his name off the top of my head but what i do know about him is that he has voted against the orange one on more than one occasion and i had an inkling that rubber stamping nominees wasn't going to sit well with him.

To be clear, the vote for senate majority lead is days over and its not a MAGA loyalist that won the role.

[Falcrack]

So Gaetz withdrew his nomination for attorney general. But Gaetz resigned earlier from congress so he could get the nomination, and avoid having to get a congressional report out on him. Now it looks like he is out of both his old job and future job!